From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 1 15:19:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id PAA07052 for kats-ll; Sat, 1 Apr 1995 15:19:49 -0500 Date: Sat, 1 Apr 1995 15:26:08 +0001 (EST) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Cancelled To: Kats@sard.mv.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: IS Swat kats still cancelled? From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 2 13:10:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA12276 for kats-ll; Sun, 2 Apr 1995 13:10:47 -0400 Date: Sun, 2 Apr 1995 10:32:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Some more stuff from the last couple of days. "Is SWATKATS still cancelled?" Yes. Right now it is. A few odd things have happened lately though. Turner entertainment has asked Hanna-Barbera for SWATKATS interstitials, stuff like "Secret Files of the SwatKats" and the promotional bumpers, for an unknown purpose. They may be shopping the show around to other networks, something I'm also working on. I'm trying not to annoy Hanna-Barbera too much, but there are a few others asking questions also - and I usually hear the answers one way or another. There are a few other positives. I hear through the grapevine that Hanna-Barbera is having some problems. The "World Premiere Shorts" thing isn't doing all that well, and the "Jonny Quest" revival may turn into an expensive disaster (Christian Tremblay said that "Jonny looks like a gay", which sounded quite hilarious in a French-Canadian accent!). Christian pointed out that he couldn't understand why they "were pouring money into this new stuff when they had something as original and successful as SWATKATS" - couldn't have said it better myself. What this boils down to, is if some of us can keep pressure on Turner, and let him know (mail letters, guys!) how much people like the show - he may be tempted to re-evaluate his position in order to keep H-B making money. The Tremblay brothers are pinning their hopes on how well the marketing does, I personally am going to clean out our Toys 'R Us when the action figures come out, and I'm going to make sure 'KATS fans get them. I keep saying this, but the only way H-B/Turner know how big a mistake they made is when the marketing people count the mail, and the amount of stuff sold. There isn't any stuff to buy, but we can sure do the "mail" bit to the hilt! Christian and Yvon are also working on a comic-book deal, although it seems like its on hold until the merchandise hits the shelves. Two other things. Christian Tremblay said he will mail me some 'KATS stuff that not too many people have seen, WKOZIOL had earlier said he would be happy to scan stuff for me - so I'll try and get him some copies to scan in and post on an FTP site for everyone to grab. The second item is that Lance Falk, one of the SWATKATS design team and a damn good writer, has now joined Warner Bros. TV Animation - to work on Animaniacs and Pinky&The Brain. Happy coincidence for me, I watch both - and I've got a friend at Warners. I've passed on what we've been up to, in this morning's e-mail, but I don't yet know if he's on-line - or willing to talk/hear about 'KATS stuff. He did say, however, that "Davis Doi was the best boss he's ever worked for", and he's well aware that the fans had NOTHING to do with the cancellation - as apparently do many of the other 98 people fired. Andy (could we have like a "roll call"? I don't know how much of Dana's c.c. list has signed up yet. Either e- me or just post something to the list saying "I'm here".) ******************** Dear Ted Turner: ********************************* :"You know, cancelling SWATKATS after advertising new eps shows us that the shoes of Messrs. Hanna and Barbera have been unoccupied far too long" : "Why's that?" :"...someone in the organization has developed 'cold feet' ". From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 04:25:27 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id EAA15628 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 04:25:19 -0400 Message-Id: <9504030836.AA08625@cisk> Subject: Administrivia and other stuff To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Mon, 3 Apr 95 1:36:17 PDT From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 2735 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Looks like list membership is growing (19 people on the list as of this message)... and as such, I thought I'd throw out some administrivia -- a few administrative notes and comments about the list: Administrative stuff for the SWAT Kats mailing list =================================================== Who's in charge: Administrative stuff -- duehara@atmos.ucla.edu (me). For technical stuff: rat@mv.mv.com (Paul Hurley). Note: my email address may change after June; if it does, this file will be updated accordingly. Subscription: The list is currently open. This means that you may join or drop yourself from the mailing list at any time by sending email to 'majordomo@lists.mv.net'. To join or drop anyone (other than yourself) from the list requires my approval. On- and off-topic stuff: Generally speaking, use your discretion. The list itself is not moderated, but I may advise people about postings which aren't really related to the list. In general, anything SWAT Kat-related is on-topic material. Related material, such as Turner Entertainment, mucking, etc. is less on-topic but may be allowed, up to a point. FAQ: no, there's no FAQ for the SWAT Kats -- *yet*. But if frequently discussed threads do come up, I will create an FAQ file. I'll post a message to the list if/when one is created. Removal: As I stated above, you may email majordomo on your own to remove yourself from the list. Removing anyone else requires my approval (and I may also verify this through email). Other grounds for being dropped from the list include, but are not limited, to: o General flaming or rabblerousing. I'll probably give at least one warning before I actually drop someone, however. o Constant off-topic posts, or leading the discussion to off- topic material. Again, there'll probably be a warning of some sort before I actually do this. o Posting of confidential material to the net. (I was nearly removed from another list because I did this once, even though I made sure that no names were involved.) This could lead to being dropped from the list without warning. o Bounced mail. This one will be at my discretion. I generally won't drop anyone for bounced mail unless s/he is either (a) at an invalid address or (b) has mail bouncing to me for at least a couple of weeks. I'll try to alert the list before I do this as well, in case someone else on the list can get in touch with the person in question. Questions: Questions and comments are always appreciated. 'Nuff said. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 04:43:53 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id EAA15650 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 04:43:53 -0400 Message-Id: <9504030854.AA08674@cisk> Subject: Re: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Mon, 3 Apr 95 1:54:56 PDT In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 2, 95 10:32:54 am From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 2016 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill writes: > Turner entertainment has asked Hanna-Barbera for SWATKATS interstitials, > stuff like "Secret Files of the SwatKats" and the promotional bumpers, > for an unknown purpose. They may be shopping the show around to other > networks, something I'm also working on. For Turner to ask HB for this stuff looks really suspicious. One thought that comes to mind (at least my mind, anyway) is that Turner might *not* want HB to shop around for other networks (in other words, Turner keeps all of the promotional bumpers, etc. so HB *can't* market the show elsewhere without Turner's knowledge and/or approval). > I personally am going to clean out our Toys 'R Us when the action > figures come out, and I'm going to make sure 'KATS fans get them. I'm also going to keep an eye out for Kats merchandise and pick it up (tho I probably won't be able to clean out any of the toy stores due to a limited budget). > Two other things. Christian Tremblay said he will mail me some > 'KATS stuff that not too many people have seen, WKOZIOL had earlier said > he would be happy to scan stuff for me - so I'll try and get him some > copies to scan in and post on an FTP site for everyone to grab. Depending on the size of the file(s), I can probably put them on my anonymous ftp directory at netcom (/pub/ra/razor). If anyone has a less crowded (in other words, more easily accessible) ftp site, please feel free to email me (or post to the list). > Andy (could we have like a "roll call"? I don't know how much of Dana's > c.c. list has signed up yet. Either e- me or just post something > to the list saying "I'm here".) In the administrivia message I sent out, we have 19 signups so far. If you want a complete list of the subscribers, you can send email to 'majordomo@lists.mv.net' with the message 'who kats' in the message body. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 10:39:31 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA16381 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 10:39:30 -0400 Date: Mon, 3 Apr 1995 08:02:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504030854.AA08674@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 3 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Andy Hill writes: > > Turner entertainment has asked Hanna-Barbera for SWATKATS interstitials, > > stuff like "Secret Files of the SwatKats" and the promotional bumpers, > > for an unknown purpose. They may be shopping the show around to other > > networks, something I'm also working on. > > For Turner to ask HB for this stuff looks really suspicious. One thought > that comes to mind (at least my mind, anyway) is that Turner might *not* > want HB to shop around for other networks (in other words, Turner keeps > all of the promotional bumpers, etc. so HB *can't* market the show > elsewhere without Turner's knowledge and/or approval). There are a lot of strange things happening that no one is speaking out on, every time that Christian tried to get any kind of response to his questions, everyone passed the buck trying to keep their job. Turner basically phoned in the cancellation, but AFTER that, three scripts had their voice tracks laid and sent to storyboards. I've been told that SAG contracts would've paid the voice cast for the 3 eps regardless of whether they did them, so this was the reason for having them lay the tracks. Maybe, but this doesn't explain why they'd bother with the 'boards. It's been suggested to me that I contact Margaret Loesch, President of Fox Kids Network - the fall schedule for action-adventure is extremely weak this year, and I hear they are shopping around. I've a letter going out this morning to her, and she's basically going to get "first refusal" before I send similar ones to ABC, CBS and the new networks. H-B is wholly owned by Turner, so they can't do anything unilaterally, but has anyone noticed a pattern developing here? CNN just restructured, it seemed an odd thing to do - and gave off the impression that they weren't making money. When the executives were questioned about it, they just had the "no comment" response. Whenever Turner has done anything that can be regarded positive in the past, you couldn't stop him commenting. TBS is running Scooby-Doo for an hour in the afternoon strip slot, and their programming seems entirely supported by two or three advertisers in the SMFTV slots. Hanna-Barbera had SWATKATS pulled out from underneath them, fine, but why so many layoffs? Odd behaviour if the "World Premiere Shorts" and "Jonny Quest" are as good as the hype makes out. Turner has lots of cash, but he seems to be getting a bit edgy when it comes his wholly-owned enterprises. He's even starting to advertise "The Cartoon Network" on Fox - odd thing to do for a man that brags he doesn't have to advertise anywhere but his own networks, nor does he have to get 85 percent clearance for new shows - he's already got the outlets himself. Yeah, right. I don't know if I already said this, but for 'toon fans - there is something abominable called the "DIC code", which is at the moment a voluntary set of standards developed by the people at DIC for their own crews. Essentially, it boils down to some really scary rules prohibiting shows that contain anything resembling a firearm, prohibiting any action imitable by kids, and ensuring that a "positive message" is delivered. Ted Turner's favourite program is "Captain Planet", and I've been hearing things like "he cancelled (SWATKATS) because he suddenly realized how violent it actually was". Turner has evidently embraced this DIC thing for his Kids programming, but I don't know for certain if this played any role in the cancel order - I'm trying to find out from some folks. Andy (sorry for the novel guys, but part of the reason shows like this vanish is because the fan group doesn't know any of the behind the scenes stuff, and always assumes cancellation is their fault. Wrong. Turner's actions here have puzzled many industry people too.) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 10:57:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA16433 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 10:57:49 -0400 Message-Id: <9504031508.AA10771@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Apr 1995 22:10:13 -0600 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: sri_students@chapel.fcasd.edu (FC SRI Students) Subject: is kats cancelled Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I still get the kats wher I live. There wasn't a break at all during the seson. -Dan From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 11:08:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA16471 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 11:08:11 -0400 Date: Mon, 3 Apr 1995 08:31:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: is kats cancelled To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504031508.AA10771@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 3 Apr 1995, FC SRI Students wrote: > I still get the kats wher I live. There wasn't a break at all > during the seson. > > > -Dan Yeah, this is kind of confusing for most people. Even though it's currently running on TBS, The Cartoon Network, and some independents - Turner cancelled further production past episode 23. For expensive programs like SWATKATS, a season's "order" is generally 13 episodes, so the second season eps in production were halted before the second 13 were completed, hence 23 eps instead of 26. Once TBS gets to ep 23, I'm not sure whether they'll drop the program, or show repeats for awhile. The Cartoon Network is supposedly only showing the first season eps (13 only), though I don't get it in Canada so I don't know for sure. 65 eps is normally the kind of support a show needs to make it attractive for syndication, but even at 23 eps, 'KATS is supposedly popular in something like 60 countries (right from Christian Tremblay). Andy (it's pay-TV up here - I even watch them scrambled..) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 3 19:20:18 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA28375 for kats-ll; Mon, 3 Apr 1995 19:20:16 -0400 Date: Mon, 3 Apr 1995 19:30:55 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: How stupid is Ted Truner? How is SWAT KATS violent? I can see little kids going around shooting each other in planes. On Mon, 3 Apr 1995, Andy Hill wrote: > > On Mon, 3 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > > > Andy Hill writes: > > > Turner entertainment has asked Hanna-Barbera for SWATKATS interstitials, > > > stuff like "Secret Files of the SwatKats" and the promotional bumpers, > > > for an unknown purpose. They may be shopping the show around to other > > > networks, something I'm also working on. > > > > For Turner to ask HB for this stuff looks really suspicious. One thought > > that comes to mind (at least my mind, anyway) is that Turner might *not* > > want HB to shop around for other networks (in other words, Turner keeps > > all of the promotional bumpers, etc. so HB *can't* market the show > > elsewhere without Turner's knowledge and/or approval). > > There are a lot of strange things happening that no one is speaking > out on, every time that Christian tried to get any kind of response to > his questions, everyone passed the buck trying to keep their job. Turner > basically phoned in the cancellation, but AFTER that, three scripts had > their voice tracks laid and sent to storyboards. I've been told that SAG > contracts would've paid the voice cast for the 3 eps regardless of > whether they did them, so this was the reason for having them lay the > tracks. Maybe, but this doesn't explain why they'd bother with the 'boards. > > It's been suggested to me that I contact Margaret Loesch, President > of Fox Kids Network - the fall schedule for action-adventure is extremely > weak this year, and I hear they are shopping around. I've a letter going > out this morning to her, and she's basically going to get "first refusal" > before I send similar ones to ABC, CBS and the new networks. > > H-B is wholly owned by Turner, so they can't do anything > unilaterally, but has anyone noticed a pattern developing here? CNN just > restructured, it seemed an odd thing to do - and gave off the impression > that they weren't making money. When the executives were questioned about > it, they just had the "no comment" response. Whenever Turner has done > anything that can be regarded positive in the past, you couldn't stop him > commenting. TBS is running Scooby-Doo for an hour in > the afternoon strip slot, and their programming seems entirely supported > by two or three advertisers in the SMFTV slots. Hanna-Barbera had > SWATKATS pulled out from underneath them, fine, but why so many layoffs? > Odd behaviour if the "World Premiere Shorts" and "Jonny Quest" are as > good as the hype makes out. Turner has lots of cash, but he seems to be > getting a bit edgy when it comes his wholly-owned enterprises. He's even > starting to advertise "The Cartoon Network" on Fox - odd thing to do for > a man that brags he doesn't have to advertise anywhere but his own > networks, nor does he have to get 85 percent clearance for new shows - > he's already got the outlets himself. Yeah, right. > > I don't know if I already said this, but for 'toon fans - there is > something abominable called the "DIC code", which is at the moment a > voluntary set of standards developed by the people at DIC for their own > crews. Essentially, it boils down to some really scary rules prohibiting > shows that contain anything resembling a firearm, prohibiting any action > imitable by kids, and ensuring that a "positive message" is delivered. > Ted Turner's favourite program is "Captain Planet", and I've been hearing > things like "he cancelled (SWATKATS) because he suddenly realized how > violent it actually was". Turner has evidently embraced this DIC thing > for his Kids programming, but I don't know for certain if this played > any role in the cancel order - I'm trying to find out from some folks. > > Andy (sorry for the novel guys, but part of the reason shows like this > vanish is because the fan group doesn't know any of the behind > the scenes stuff, and always assumes cancellation is their fault. > Wrong. Turner's actions here have puzzled many industry people > too.) > > > From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 04:06:34 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id EAA00661 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 04:06:32 -0400 Message-Id: <9504040817.AA22412@cisk> Subject: Re: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 4 Apr 95 1:17:41 PDT In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 3, 95 08:02:32 am From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1216 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill writes: > I've been told that SAG contracts would've paid the voice cast for the > 3 eps regardless of whether they did them, so this was the reason for > having them lay the tracks. Maybe this has something to do with Barry Gordon (Razor's voice) being the president of the SAG. ;-) As Andy pointed out in another post, just because the series is "cancelled" doesn't mean it will be, or has been, yanked in mid-season. There was some discussion about this on the net, although I don't know the details offhand. In case anyone is wondering, btw, TBS is currently showing first-season episodes (some with second-season opening music and credits). And so I don't waste bandwidth with another post, I saw a recent posting to the list that had 20-30 lines of quoted text and only about three lines or so of original comments. Please don't do this, if you can. In particular, quoted text and .sig files should be kept to a minimum (a rule of thumb I use is to, as much as possible, have more lines of original text than the quoted text and my .sig combined). -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 09:58:43 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA01507 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 09:58:33 -0400 Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 07:09:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: 'KATS have nine lives! To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504040817.AA22412@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 4 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Maybe this has something to do with Barry Gordon (Razor's voice) being > the president of the SAG. ;-) Heh. Yeah, I just heard this a couple of days ago. > As Andy pointed out in another post, just because the series is > "cancelled" doesn't mean it will be, or has been, yanked in mid-season. > There was some discussion about this on the net, although I don't know > the details offhand. It's hard to get information from any aspect of the Turner org. I will try and find out how long TBS will run them for sure. > In case anyone is wondering, btw, TBS is currently showing first-season > episodes (some with second-season opening music and credits). Yeah, speaking of this - I like the original music and titles FAR better - but they were evidently changed because it was felt that T-Bone/Razor and the TurboKat should be introduced to your eyes before the Monsters. There are versions of the original 13 with both styles of titles. The music to go with the "Turner Program Services" tag was also changed. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 10:17:21 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01637 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 10:17:20 -0400 Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 07:27:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Lance Falk writes AND talks well. To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: In case no one knows who Lance Falk is, he wrote some of the better eps like "Chaos in Crystal", and I believe "Metal Urgency". One of my associates is doing an article for Animato!, and along with a complete episode guide, is putting together some quotes from people that work(ed) on the show - he caught up with Lance on the weekend. I'll have a draft of the article before it's June release, but here's some of the stuff Lance had to say (he now works at Warners on PATB and Animaniacs): Regarding "Chaos in Crystal", the Rexx Shard character was going to be brought back for further eps, each time having a different "power", and each time he was defeated by the guys he would have another physical scar as a souvenir, such as an eye-patch, lost limb etc. During development sessions at Hanna-Barbera, Lance (who was also a designer on the show) contributed the idea that aside from Jake and Chance just being city junkmen/garage mechanics - that they should also have all kinds of military surplus dumped there as well - this was originally not going to be the case. This is in no small part responsible for the origins of the TurboKat, and the reason that the MetalliKat Express was dumped there. Lance landed the job at H-B for the 'KATS because he'd worked with Producer Davis Doi as art director on "Capitol Critters", and wanted to follow Davis to his next project - "SWATKATS". Davis was so impressed with Lance that he let Lance art-direct the scripts he wrote - very unusual in cartoon-land. Lance also did a couple of scripts for "StarTrek:The Next Generation", but none of them were picked up. Oh yeah...the TurboKat is modelled after an F-14 TomCat - for those who hadn't already figured it out! I had my friend at Warner's pass some stuff on to Lance - so hopefully he'll contact me on the net - and maybe join the list. He didn't seem to want to "brush off" his association with the 'KATS, so maybe I'll hear more. Andy (hey "razor", how about that article on the music? One of us should also put up the "Comics Scene" thing about the cancellation.) ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 10:53:21 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01890 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 10:53:21 -0400 Message-Id: <9504041504.AA11589@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 22:05:58 -0600 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: sri_students@chapel.fcasd.edu (FC SRI Students) Subject: KATS WEAPONS LIST Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Is there a list of wepons for the kats. Like at the end of each show. -Dan From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 16:53:52 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id QAA04679 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 16:53:46 -0400 Message-Id: <9504042105.AA29169@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 14:06:23 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) content-length: 1524 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy sez: >Andy (hey "razor", how about that article on the music? One of us should also > put up the "Comics Scene" thing about the cancellation.) OK -- as requested, here is the _Comics Scene_ article about the series' cancellation. I'll send the episode guide I have (which, btw, is also available on my WWW server) in a separate post. SWAT Kats Canned_: It happened unexpectedly. SWAT Kats was doing reasonably well in the ratings, and there was talk of a third season. By late July, 13 episodes had been recorded for the show's second season; production was underway on episode #11. Suddenly, Turner Entertainment ordered its subsidary, Hanna-Barbera, to cancel production altogether, and lay off creative personnel throughout the studio. The purge affected 23 in-house artists (including half the background department) and 75 freelancers. As for SWAT Kats' cancellation, former employees were told that the show wasn't selling enough merchandise. But that's because there was hardly any merchandise or marketing to begin with! Therefore, Turner decided to cancel the show. Go figure. SWAT Kats will have 10 new episodes this year; the final three have been recorded and storyboarded and, at this point, are in limbo. First season episodes are now being broadcast on the Cartoon Network. ***** ("Animation Scene", p. 66, _Comics Scene #48_) -- ==================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ===================== "T-Bone, if you drown... I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 17:13:38 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA04759 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 17:13:38 -0400 Message-Id: <9504042124.AA29446@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 14:26:12 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) content-length: 6543 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Here's the article I got from _Toon Magazine_. I posted this some time ago to the net. I'll also post the episode list (from the same source). source: _Toon_ Magazine, Vol. 1, No. 5, Fall 1994 Hanna-Barbera's SWAT Kats: The Best New Action-Adventure Series To Come From Hanna-Barbera In Years! by Michael Swanigan Hanna-Barbera's _SWAT Kats: The Radical Squadron_ already has proven to be a bonafide hit. Arriving nationally in syndication and on TBS Superstation in September of '93, the thrills and tactics have put Hanna-Barbera squarely back at the forefront of action-adventure genre they pioneered in the 1960's with _Jonny Quest_. The crew at Hanna-Barbera wanted to create a cartoon pulsing with sensory overload. SWAT Kats takes passengers into the cockpit with two feline daredevils and their jet as they rip through skyscraper canyons and dash across the skies of Megakat City in pursuit of the world's baddest kats. Replete with nonstop video-game action, high-tech laser gadgetry, heart-stopping danger, daring rescues and a driving soundtrack, the all-kat world of SWAT Kats: The Radical Squadron arrived on television. Two ex-pilots have assumed secret identities and taken to the skies in their incredible Turbokat jet. Creators and executive producers, Yvon and Christian Tremblay, wanted a world infused with vibrant colors and roaring action. "SWAT Kats leap to life in comic book style taking viewers along for the ride, solving crime like no other superheroes ever have," said Christian Tremblay. Each episode finds the heroes, Jake and Chance, challenged by one of the myriad of unique villains who inhabit the huge city populated only by cats. Jake and Chance transform themselves into the SWAT Kats, Razor and T-Bone, who battle Dark Kat, overlord of crime; the Pastmaster, a time-traveling evil creature; the Metallikats, a bionic clawing couple, and other larger-than-life foes. This super-team distinguish themselves from other heroes with two qualities: inventiveness and speed. Instead of weapons, the SWAT Kats have developed a stock of devices that assist them in capturing criminals. New gadgets play a major role in the action and include the crook-catching Octopus Missile, Glovatrix and Cyclotron, among others. "Our Kats use their wits and ingenuity in settling the score. They use gadgets that stop villains rather than go after crime with brawn and armor," says Christian Tremblay. "Ultimately their schemes and devices find more excitement and adventure than mere fighting would." As the world's foremost expert fighter pilots, Jake and Chance bring determination, flair and skills to the skies. They met during Enforcer training and flew many combat missions together. An unlikely looking pair, they established a friendship in the cockpit, where it was camaraderie at first flight. Together, they were their own "Radical Squadron." But they disdained all the rules and regulations that Commander Feral and the Megakat Force laid on them. Feral, in turn, hated them for their independence, stubbornness and superior skills. On one fateful day, Commander Feral cut them off when they were in pursuit of Dark Kat. Feral's reckless move clipped the tail of Chance and Jake's jet which crashed into Enforcer Headquarters, almost destroying it. Afterwards Feral destroyed their careers, drumming them out of the service and relegated them to pay off their societal debt by running the Megakat City Salvage Yard. The two mechanics eventually invented crime-fighting mechanisms from the junk surrounding them, and built their own one-of-a-kind Turbokat jet. Now they combat villains on their own terms. Music helps set the tone for the SWAT Kats' mighty feats. According to Christian Tremblay, "How better to rev up the adrenaline than with a score that captivates the mood and accentuates the action." The music selection relies on Queen (the rock band) influences and adds effects that may be heard emanating from a neighborhood arcade. Since the SWAT Kats' escapades speed along at video-game pace, the sound effects of the Kats' missions could be mistaken as edits from the latest Nintendo craze. Long regarded as the expert in animation sound effects (from the scrambling of Fred Flintstone's feet to Jerry's pulling of Tom's whiskers), Hanna-Barbera continues its tradition with the soaring, roaring, dashing, crashing audio antics for the SWAT Kats' series. CHANCE/T-BONE Big-framed, burly Chance springs into action as a leap-before-you-look daredevil who loves danger and daring-do. The riskier the enterprise, the happier he is. As pilot of the Turbokat, he jettisons the plane to heights never before imagined. His hard-core ways contrast his partner Jake's naturally cautious bent. Secure and cocky, Chance likes to ignore Jake's warnings. He fancies himself a ladies man, but generally has more success in a maniac in the [skies]. JAKE/RAZOR As co-pilot, navigator, gadgets expert and idea kat, Jake has designed most of the special unique firepower the Turbokat carries. More comfortable around technical wizardry, Jake gets nervous around a pretty girl. Further clashing with Chance's style, the smaller Jake conducts business in more laconic manner. But when confronted with danger and villains, Jake bursts into the situation, as agile as his partner. COMMANDER FERAL A lean, tough, by-the-book police veteran, Commander Feral displays his militant, power-hungry way to prevent anyone from going around him. However, the SWAT Kats go around, up and over him. Furious that the SWAT Kats always end up doing his job, Feral boils over seeing his Enforcers look bad against Megakat City's villains. MAYOR MANX Always ready to come up with an excuse for getting out of a prickly situation, Mayor Manx happily leaves all the dirty chores to Callie Briggs. Despite his coward, he remains in office largely because the SWAT Kats always manage to bring Megakat City back from total catastrophe and destruction. CALLIE BRIGGS The fearless, strong-willed right-hand woman to do-nothing Mayor Manx, Callico (Callie) Briggs pounces on any situation that may put her beloved Megakat City in danger. Callie often becomes the trouble shooter who gets sent into dangerous situations so the Mayor can get information without endangering his life. Though she does not know the true identity of the SWAT Kats, Callie has a 'hot line' that can summon them when trouble arises. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 17:30:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA04809 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 17:30:21 -0400 Message-Id: <9504042141.AA00026@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 14:43:00 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Re: KATS WEAPONS LIST content-length: 620 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: FC SRI Students writes: > Is there a list of wepons for the kats. Like at the end of each show. Here are a few I can name off the top of my head. I'm not including weapons or gadgets that were used in only one episode, however: Glovatrix (fires a number of different devices, including grappling hooks and mini cement launchers) Cyclotron Missile (not a weapon per se, but still handy) Octopus Missile Slicer Missile Spider Missile Cement Launcher Turbokat (fully equipped, natch ;-) Ejektor Seat (not a weapon, but a really useful gadget, also equipped with assorted weaponry) Any others? From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 17:33:02 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA04824 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 17:33:02 -0400 Message-Id: <9504042144.AA00072@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="========================_11965244==_" Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 14:45:29 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: SWAT Kats episode list content-length: 6560 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: --========================_11965244==_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" And here is the episode list for the SWAT Kats (also from _Toon Magazine_): --========================_11965244==_ Content-Type: text/plain; name="skeplist.toon"; charset="us-ascii" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="skeplist.toon" SWAT KATS: THE RADICAL SQUADRON EPISODE LIST AND CREDITS Executive Producer ..................................... Buzz Potamkin Producer ................................................... Davis Doi Story Editor ........................................... Glenn Leopold Director .............................................. Robert Alvarez Creators/Production Designers ...... Christian Tremblay, Yvon Tremblay Storyboard Supervisors ................ Barrington Bruce, Vic DelChele T-BONE/CHANCE/MURRAY ................................... Charlie Adler RAZOR/JAKE .............................................. Barry Gordon COMMANDER FERAL ........................................... Gary Owens CALLIE BRIGGS ........................................ Tress MacNeille MAYOR MANX .............................................. Jim Cummings BURKE .................................................... Mark Hamill ----- SEASON #1 (1993) ----- THE GIANT BACTERIA When Dr. Viper creates a giant bacteria to help him break into Megakat Biochemical Labs, it is up to the SWAT Kats to stop him... before Megakat City is destroyed! THE METALLIKATS Two mobsters, Mac and Molly, return from the grave as deadly robots. As the "Metallikats", these metal fiends terrorize city hall with an arsenal of amazing gadgets even the SWAT Kats find tough to beat. THE PASTMASTER ALWAYS RINGS TWICE The SWAT Kats race against time to stop an "undead" evil sorcerer named the Pastmaster, who intends to send Megakat City back into the Dark Ages. But first our heroes must battle their way back from the prehistoric past. DESTRUCTIVE NATURE Doctor Viper is back with a hideous army of plant monsters. Only the SWAT Kats can stop him from turning Megakat City in Mega-Swamp [City]. THE WRATH OF DARK KAT In their most desperate mission ever, the SWAT Kats battle Dark Kat, who has created a Doomsday Device to destroy Megakat City. It is not their first encounter with the villain -- because of him they were booted out of the Enforcers. BRIDE OF THE PASTMASTER When the SWAT Kats are accidentally brought back into the Dark Ages, they save the Queen of ancient Megalith City from the Pastmaster's mythical monsters... and his wedding proposals. NIGHT OF THE DARK KAT Dark Kat uses a techno-villain named Hard Drive to lure the SWAT Kats into a deadly trap, then steals the Turbokat and wreaks havoc on Megakat City. THE GHOST PILOT When a ghostly Megawar II pilot returns from a watery grave and targets Mayor Manx, the SWAT Kats must do battle with this ancient air ace... who is almost impossible to destroy. CHAOS IN CRYSTAL When a freak accident turns a hardened criminal into a giant crystal colossus with a mineral "Midas Touch", it is up to the SWAT Kats to stop him before Megakat City is destroyed. THE CI-KAT-A A space probe returns to Megakat City carrying a deadly cargo -- an alien insect determined to take over the world. The SWAT Kats must stop the Ci-Kat-A before he turns every citizen into bug-eyed slaves. ENTER THE MADKAT Madkat is a supernatural jester, who pops out of an ancient Jack-in-the- Box to start wreaking havoc on Megakat City. Armed with giant razor sharp playing cards, spiked dice, and the ability to appear and disappear anywhere (including the Turbokat cockpit), Madkat seems unstoppable. Somehow the SWAT Kats must find a way to destroy him before they disappear into his giant Jack-in-the-Box. METAL URGENCY The Metallikats are back, and this time they are in the drivers seat of two giant attack robots. Even the Turbokat seems helpless against these armored leviathans -- who can only be destroyed by each other. The SWAT Kats use a desperate scheme to gain control of one of the robots to defeat the Metallikats. KATASTROPHE The SWAT Kats face their toughest challenge when Dark Kat forms an evil alliance with Dr. Viper and the Metallikats. The fate of Megakat City hangs in the balance. ----- SEASON #2 EPISODES (1994) ----- MUTATION CITY When Dr. Viper submerges half of Megakat City in a mutation filled swamp, the SWAT Kats must venture through "Mutation City" to get the anti- mutagens to stop him. One problem: T-Bone can't swim. A BRIGHT AND SHINY FUTURE The Pastmaster propels the SWAT Kats into a sinister future world he has prepared for them: a world where the evil Metallikats and their giant robot Enforcers rule. WHEN STRIKES MUTILOR It's a deadly "close encounter" when Razor and T-Bone defend Megakat City from the awesome threat of Mutilor, the interstellar water pirate, as he tries to steal the oceans from the planet. RAZOR'S EDGE When innocent Kat civilians are apparently injured during a SWAT Kats pursuit, Razor loses his nerve. CRY TURMOIL The SWAT Kats tangle with the elite fighter squadron of Turmoil, evil Empress of the Air, who falls for T-Bone. SWAT KATS UNPLUGGED When electro-villain Hard Drive renders the Turbokat's high-tech gadgets useless, the SWAT Kats must rely solely on their skill and smarts to defeat him. THE DEADLY PYRAMID The Pastmaster returns, raising an ancient pyramid full of giant warrior mummies, who are going to help him conquer Megakat City. But the SWAT Kats have other ideas. CAVERNS OF HORROR The SWAT Kats are the only ones who can rescue newscaster Ann Gora from a mine cave-in, but when they go underground, they find more than they bargained for: a cavern of giant mutated rock scorpions with an unhealthy taste for kats. VOLCANUS ERUPTS! When the evil fire demon Volcanus is accidentally released from his island prison, it's up to the SWAT Kats to put out the fire. THE ORIGIN OF DR. VIPER When Dr. Elrod Purvis tries to steal a regenerative growth formula, it spills on him and transforms him into the insidious Dr. Viper. Only the SWAT Kats can stop him from turning Callie and Mayor Manx into mutations, too! THE DARK SIDE OF THE SWAT KATS The SWAT Kats find themselves in an alternate universe, where evil SWAT Kats are in league with Dark Kat, in a plan to destroy the Enforcers. UNLIKELY ALLOYS The SWAT Kats battle a giant intelligent machine that consumes other machines. And this time, they have an unlikely ally... one of the Metallikats. --========================_11965244==_-- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 21:33:40 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA06074 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 21:33:39 -0400 Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 18:44:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: KATS WEAPONS LIST To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504042141.AA00026@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 4 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > FC SRI Students writes: > > Is there a list of wepons for the kats. Like at the end of each show. > > Here are a few I can name off the top of my head. I'm not including > weapons or gadgets that were used in only one episode, however: > > Glovatrix (fires a number of different devices, including grappling hooks and > mini cement launchers) > Cyclotron Missile (not a weapon per se, but still handy) > Octopus Missile > Slicer Missile > Spider Missile > Cement Launcher > Turbokat (fully equipped, natch ;-) > Ejektor Seat (not a weapon, but a really useful gadget, also equipped with > assorted weaponry) > > Any others? Yep. Match-head missile Banshee Missile ("those demons should've done more squrimin' and less screamin') Buzz-saw missile (I think) MegaVolt missile (seems to nuke everyone's shields nicely) Just off the top of my head also! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 4 23:31:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA06744 for kats-ll; Tue, 4 Apr 1995 23:31:30 -0400 From: August Yang Message-Id: <199504050342.XAA15574@ritz.mordor.com> Subject: SWAT Kats Merchandise To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 4 Apr 1995 23:42:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 736 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Gods, I hope I'm sending this to the right address. Forgive me if it's wrong. If any of you thought that SWAT Kats would have made one killer comic, bad news. Archie, who currently is producing Hanna Barbara (sp?) comix will only do a SWAT Kats comic if HB asks them to. In any case, I know that Hudson Soft is releasing a SWAT Kats vidgame for the SNES. I'm not sure if there will be a Genesis version though. August Paul Yang bought an SNES for, partly, this reason. -- wntrmute@ritz.mordor.com | For my Life Public Relations and Official Test Audience for the FDC | Still ahead, "Have you any idea how successful censorship is on TV? | Pity me. -Queen Don't know the answer? Hm. Successful. Isn't it?" -Max Headroom From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 5 09:23:39 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08272 for kats-ll; Wed, 5 Apr 1995 09:23:26 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Apr 1995 06:34:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: SWAT Kats Merchandise To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504050342.XAA15574@ritz.mordor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 4 Apr 1995, August Yang wrote: > Gods, I hope I'm sending this to the right address. Forgive me if > it's wrong. > > If any of you thought that SWAT Kats would have made one killer comic, > bad news. Archie, who currently is producing Hanna Barbara (sp?) comix > will only do a SWAT Kats comic if HB asks them to. > > In any case, I know that Hudson Soft is releasing a SWAT Kats vidgame > for the SNES. I'm not sure if there will be a Genesis version though. > > August Paul Yang bought an SNES for, partly, this reason. > -- Man, some days things work really mysteriously. I just had a call on the "comic thing" today from someone in Iowa that the Tremblays also talk too. There is an artist, I think for some of the more Furry-things, by the name of Malachi Keller - who has done some killer SWATKATS art. Anyway, the Tremblays talked to this guy concerning doing a comic - which, if they could get backing, would be quite "serious" and unlike anything that Archie Comix would ever do (TMNTA comes to mind in a negative light - it's too kiddiefied despite some great writing on occasion). Again, the Tremblay bros. say that anything future along the SWATKATS line, including the comics, are largely going to depend on how successful the merchandising of the toys and games is. Most people who call me and realize I'm "into" the KATS have asked me to pick up whatever I can - and they're all interested in the toys, the SNES game, T-Shirts - whatever they can get their hands on. I just hope that this isn't lost on Turner. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 5 09:27:10 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08285 for kats-ll; Wed, 5 Apr 1995 09:27:09 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Apr 1995 06:38:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: KATS WEAPONS LIST To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I forgot a couple of the missiles, each of which was only used the once as far as I know. "Cookie Cutter" missile : "The Giant Bacteria" "Pincer Missile" : "Bride of the Pastmaster" - to remove T-Bone's "oil-suckin' eel" from the tanker. (only Charlie Adler could carry off a line like that one...) ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 5 09:34:21 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08326 for kats-ll; Wed, 5 Apr 1995 09:34:20 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Apr 1995 06:45:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Music - Freddy Mercury would be proud To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504042105.AA29169@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Next time you watch "Pastmaster Always Rings Twice" - check out the incidental music when the Pastmaster re-animates the pile of bones - and they start to chase the grave-robbers. Man, when I first heard this bit and most of the music that accompanies the TurboKat when it's in the air, I realized I'd be taping this 'toon whenever I could. Even it's more expensive competition (BTAS, Gargoyles) have fairly mundane tracks compared to those on the 'KATS. What will really piss me off is if they reactivate the project, but too late to save some of the people associated with it from going to other projects (Glenn Leopold is still at H-B, but he's writing for 1996's "Jonny Quest" - though I think all the music people are still around). Andy ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 5 09:43:17 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08354 for kats-ll; Wed, 5 Apr 1995 09:43:15 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Apr 1995 06:54:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "We like the show - where do we write?" To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504042105.AA29169@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Here's me telling everyone to write to save the show, and I've never put the addresses up, so here goes: Hanna-Barbera Cartoons 3400 Cahuenga Blvd. West Hollywood, CA 90068 Attn: Fred Seibert/SWATKATS (Mail here gets 11 copies made of it, and sent to many different people) Every letter to above is counted by marketing folks, and I've heard through some people there, and other places, that "volume of mail will have a bearing on future developments" - whatever the hell that means. Here's some others, I've written to all of them once, and the second wave is about to begin. I think Ted Turner needs to read more, how about y'all? Turner Program Services 1 CNN Center Box 105366 Atlanta, GA 30348-5366 and TBS itself, TBS Superstation 1050 Techwood Dr. NW Box 105264 Atlanta, GA 30318-5264 Also, I plan to forward fan mail to the Tremblays - and if you forward it to my e-mail address (chance@unix.inforserve.net), I'll send it out on the fax to them - and Hanna-Barbera. See, Turner pissed off the wrong guy. ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 7 10:26:57 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA23853 for kats-ll; Fri, 7 Apr 1995 10:26:49 -0400 Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 07:40:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: (fwd) Re: SWAT Kats: Better Than You Think (fwd) To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Only some of us have access to the newsgroup rec.arts.animation - so here's part one of a post/followup exchange that took place on it. Comments appreciated. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 19:13:35 -0700 From: Andy Hill To: chance@unix.infoserve.net Subject: (fwd) Re: SWAT Kats: Better Than You Think Newsgroups: rec.arts.animation Path: news.infoserve.net!news.bc.net!torn!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu!klknole From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Subject: Re: SWAT Kats: Better Than You Think Message-ID: <1995Apr2.104448.16008@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Date: Sun, 2 Apr 1995 10:44:48 GMT Organization: Illinois State University X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Lines: 47 I don't think very many people realize just how good SWAT Kats: The Radical Squadron really is. You see, not all SWAT Kats episodes are the same, and I don't simply mean that certain episodes are slighty better than others. I mean the best episodes absolutely crush the worst and grind them underfoot, and this is almost entirely due to one thing: The animation. SWAT Kats is conditionally the best animated American animated series ever. I say conditionally because that honor cannot be bestowed upon every episode. Here's the deal. In the first season of SWAT Kats, there were, of course, 13 episodes. 9 were animated by Hanho Heung-up Company Ltd., and the other 4 were animated by Mook. While the level of writing, directing, and music for all those episodes were about at the same level (There were a few standouts), the animation by Hanho Heung-up sucked big time. The animation by Mook, however, was consistently excellent, even stunning in moments. I was first exposed to SWAT Kats through one of the Mook episodes, and if it hadn't have been for such a good first impression, I might not be the fan that I am now. When it came time for the second season to premeire, I was very nervous. I was wondering if the second season was going to be animated by Mook or Hanho Heung-up. I was overjoyed to learn that it was animated by Mook. The second season premeire blew me away with animation superior to anything in the first season (Mook episodes included), and so has every second season episode since (There are 10). Unfortunately, TBS has been rerunning every episode of SWAT Kats rather than just the Mook epsidoes. While this does assure less repeat showings, it also creates too many bad first impressions with viewers. My advice is to set your VCR for TBS at 6:35 a.m. Sundays, 4:05 p.m. Sundays, and 6:35 a.m. Fridays. You should be warned that SWAT Kats is not always shown at Sundays at 4:05 p.m. and Fridays at 6:35 a.m. If you want to be certain that you will see one of the better animated episodes, rewind the tape to the end of the credits and check the animation company. If it's by Mook, then rewind all the way to beginning and enjoy. If it's by Hanho Heung-Up, only watch with the understanding that what you are seeing is not SWAT Kats at its best (Far from it.). You will probably want to watch the opening no matter what. It's the same for every episode and features some very impresive animation by Mook (More specifically, there are 2 openings. The first season opening features a few seconds of original Mook animation and the rest is made of clips from assorted episodes by both Mook and Hanho Heung-Up. The second sesason opening is entirely original animation by Mook.) If you do eventually catch some of the Mook animated episodes (especially from the second season), then I think you will agree with me that this is as good as Television animation has ever been, and realize what a tragedy it was that the series has been canceled. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu -- ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 7 10:29:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA23866 for kats-ll; Fri, 7 Apr 1995 10:29:43 -0400 Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 07:42:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: (fwd) Re: SWAT Kats: Better Tha (fwd) To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Here's part two of the rec.arts.animation exchange - this was a response to the previous "better than you think" post, and is from someone who's idea of God looks surprisingly like John Kricfalusi - creator of Ren and Stimpy. She shouldn't be "flamed" for expressing her opinion, but I'm sure she'd appreciate positive feedback. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 6 Apr 1995 19:18:05 -0700 From: Andy Hill To: chance@unix.infoserve.net Subject: (fwd) Re: SWAT Kats: Better Tha Path: news.infoserve.net!news.bc.net!unixg.ubc.ca!nntp.cs.ubc.ca!psgrain!news.sprintlink.net!news.clark.net!rahul.net!a2i!kaiwan.kaiwan.com!ledge!michelle.hass From: michelle.hass@ledge.com (MICHELLE HASS) Newsgroups: rec.arts.animation Subject: Re: SWAT Kats: Better Tha Message-ID: <8A6B305.018F00179E.uuout@ledge.com> Date: Mon, 03 Apr 95 12:53:00 -0800 Distribution: world Organization: The Ledge PCBoard: Lake View Terrace, CA: USA: 818-896-2007 Reply-To: michelle.hass@ledge.com (MICHELLE HASS) References: <8A6A38B.018F00176F.uuout@ledge.com> X-Newsreader: PCBoard Version 15.21 X-Mailer: PCBoard/UUOUT Version 1.10 Lines: 22 From: michelle.hass@ledge.com KLK> SWAT Kats is conditionally the best animated American animated series e KLK>I say conditionally because that honor cannot be bestowed upon every episod KLK>Here's the deal. Obviously you have never seen The Tick and/or the (1994) Baby Huey Show. The latter is technically Canadian, but still, that's NORTH America, isn't it? The Tick puts SWAT Kats to shame in just about everything, including character design, storylines, voice acting, animation...the whole enchilada. The recent Baby Hueys which were done entirely at Carbunkle Cartoons in Vancouver, Canada had a little edge for me as far as the actual animation. SWAT Kats was pretty much interchangeable with most superhero/toy driven shows that have been out in the past decade or so. IMHO, of course. --.\\<-H-- michelle.hass@ledge.com * SLMR 2.1a * Support creators rights for animation creators! -- ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 7 10:32:26 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA23882 for kats-ll; Fri, 7 Apr 1995 10:32:25 -0400 Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 07:45:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: (fwd) SWATKATS: Toy Driven? Guess again. (fwd) To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: This is the last part of the rec.arts.animation exchange. Input concerning this can be made here for the KATS fans, or on r.a.a. to help create a voice equal to people like Michelle Hass - just not louder. Chance ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 07:21:35 -0700 From: Andy Hill To: chance@unix.infoserve.net Subject: (fwd) SWATKATS: Toy Driven? Guess again. Path: news.infoserve.net!unix.infoserve.net!chance From: chance@unix.infoserve.net (Andy Hill) Newsgroups: rec.arts.animation Subject: SWATKATS: Toy Driven? Guess again. Date: 7 Apr 1995 14:12:23 GMT Organization: Infoserve Technology Ltd. Lines: 88 Message-ID: <3m3h87$raa@news.infoserve.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: unix.infoserve.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Michelle Hass's post begs further comment concerning SWATKATS being "interchangeable with most superhero/toy driven shows". Just as she has no problem recognizing John Kricfalusi as "original" with Ren&Stimpy, the same respect should be accorded Christian and Yvon Tremblay for something so different from its competition. (Quite a few industry folks read this group, correction appreciated if I make a mistake in the following - I'm still learning). SWATKATS was insipired by the success of "independent" shows like "The Smurfs" and "TMNT", Christian and Yvon Tremblay came up with the ideas behind "SWATKATS" and taught themselves how to draw in the basement of their Montreal home. The idea grew, as did their skill at drawing, and they began to make inquiries in the animation world as to whether there would be any interest in producing a show based on the characters and situations they'd developed. They found Hollywood "amazingly receptive", and after many phone calls and flights to California out of their own pocket, managed to hammer out a deal with Turner Program Services and Hanna-Barbera, who were looking to expand their kids programming out of the Flintstones/Jetsons cycle they were in. Everything was to be a fresh start - incidental and theme music was to be a radical departure from traditional action adventure, leaning towards "metal", and being heavily inspired by the rock group "Queen". Rather than create another "mutants among humans" scenario, the entire cast was to be composed of cat characters like the main protagonists - causing the storylines to center around character interaction as opposed to mutant/human frictions. Instead of just sitting back and living off the royalties, the Tremblay brothers created pretty much the entire visual styling "bible" for the show, ensuring that the "look" stayed true to their original concept, and making sure that the show remained very much "hands on" for them. The first 13 eps were completed and run on Turner's TBS, starting in Fall 1993. At NATPE in the fall of the same year, John Walden, Sr. Vice-President of Turner Marketing, bragged that Turner didn't need the standard 85 percent clearance to air the program, stating that "because of our outlets...we already have enough support to effect production". Turner Program Services' Steve Lablang was also excited about the program, citing it and Two Stupid Dogs " as (doing) a better job of improving kids audience than anything else introduced this past fall". Success had begun to pay off, and between the weeks of 8/30/93 and 4/17/94, "SWATKATS" was the #1 rated new syndicated cartoon - no small feat for something that steered completely clear of Marvel-dom. TV Guide in Canada took notice, and ran an entire page dedicated to the SWATKATS back-story - something that's never happened for a mere cartoon in my memory. "Comics Scene" and a few other publications also took note, and ran articles that raved about the show in no uncertain terms. It was syndicated in something like 60 countries, and even did well in the Western CONUS and Canada - despite the fact TBS aired it at 4:35 in the morning. When I started to get contacted by people who also watched the program, nobody "could believe it was done by Hanna-Barbera". As far as the success being due to being "interchangeable with most superhero/toy driven shows" goes, be aware that you can't label a program as 22 minutes worth of toy advertising when there aren't even going to be any toys/games until at least July - supposedly when TBS is going to pull the program - it's popular with its viewers simply because it's a good show - not because there's lots of neat stuff to play with. There aren't too many things that John K. and I agree on, but one of them is the appreciation for characters that are believable, and have character-driven dialogue. Listen to the main characters in SWATKATS; you're not hearing "writer-speak", you are hearing the characters bouncing lines off of each other as though they actually existed. I'll even quote John Kricfalusi here: "the ability to find a balance between artful prose and natureal, character-driven dialogue is a rare talent". Rare indeed, but the Tremblays, Glenn Leopold, Eric Clark and Lance Falk showed us it could be done with even the most unusual of characters, and done well. This show is unique as regards any aspect you care to mention, and fans aren't the only ones who took notice, my mailbox had a number of anonymous contributions after some of my earlier 'KATS posts - one of the more interesting was from someone who identified himself as "an employee of Disney TV" who "wished to let (me) know that...marketing people here laughed openly at Turner when they heard Swat Cats (sic) was being cancelled". No one can smell lost revenue like the Mouse. -- ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ -- ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 7 11:32:09 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA24072 for kats-ll; Fri, 7 Apr 1995 11:32:08 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f855cae4459002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Fri, 7 Apr 95 10:39:26 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Hi, Everyone! Content-Length: 317 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Just wanted to say 'hi' to everyone on the Swat Kats mailing list. I'll have more to comment on, later. Cheers! -Tim ---- Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" -Percival McLeach From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 8 12:29:39 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA29063 for kats-ll; Sat, 8 Apr 1995 12:29:34 -0400 Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 09:43:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Two T-Bones for Every Dr. Viper... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Just got off the phone with a guy who received some production samples of the new action figures from the manufacturer, Remco. Out of the four, T-Bone and Razor are the best - they've got some "extra stuff" on their flight-harnesses, but are otherwise good likenesses of what's seen on the show. Dr. Viper is also quite good, although he's been made without his lab-coat, and DarkKat, though good, doesn't much resemble the TV version - although all the action figures/artwork has been approved by H-B and the Tremblay bros. Remco is going to produce twice as many Razor and T-Bone characters as they are the villians, and the release date has been rolled back to August from July. Strangely enough, putting back the release date is actually good news. It seems that arrangements had been made with Remco quite early in 1994, and Turner had cancelled the merchandise deals when he cancelled the program, which is why the toys didn't hit the stores at Christmas 94 like originally intended. Turner changed his mind, and made a commitment to Remco for "a large order" - seems kind of strange to do something like this if the program is to remain dead. A friend has conducted an interview with John Zuker, the guy pretty much responsible for the music in the show, and he explains where the inspiration for the Queen/Heavy Metal sound came from. I'll have the transcript of this, and the interview with Lance Falk, sometime in the next couple of weeks, and I'll transcribe a version of each for the mailing list. Lastly, grapevine says that SWATKATS articles written to rec.arts.animation have been "getting attention" from Turner Program Services, though just at the lurker level currently (don't know about alt.fan.furry). I didn't give this much thought at first, but one individual from the Turner group posted there yesterday concerning the "World Premiere Shorts". This individual does not deserve to be flooded with KATS mail - but if anyone's got an opinion to express on r.a.a., be advised that such people are listening. Andy ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 8 13:37:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA29223 for kats-ll; Sat, 8 Apr 1995 13:37:27 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f86ccab70f7002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Sat, 8 Apr 95 12:49:31 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Two T-Bones for Every Dr. Viper... Content-Length: 356 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: This is good news! Can't wait for July. :) BTW, I have a scanner, and I can post images of this stuff to the mailing list if you can send copies/photos. -Tim ---- Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" -Percival McLeach From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 10 10:57:55 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA09223 for kats-ll; Mon, 10 Apr 1995 10:57:35 -0400 Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 08:01:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: EMMY nominations are out...AWW, CRUD! To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Just got hold of the Emmy nominations from someone at Warners, would you believe that SWATKATS has been completely left off - even in the technical categories? Get this, the Emmy crowd nominated "Two Stupid Dogs" in a couple of categories, but ignored the 'KATS. I was hoping that at least the voice artists would make it into some category, but the nomination roll has only listed "name" stars like Lily Tomlin and Tim Curry - "work for a living" guys like Tress MacNeille, Barry Gordon and Charlie Adler were totally ignored. This pissed off a lot of people in the industry, so it's likely to change next year. Andy ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 11 17:34:16 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA16556 for kats-ll; Tue, 11 Apr 1995 17:33:47 -0400 From: Doctor Enigma Message-Id: <199504112135.RAA11677@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Subject: Re: EMMY nominations are out...AWW, CRUD! To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 17:35:24 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 10, 95 08:01:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1168 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Just got hold of the Emmy nominations from someone at Warners, would > you believe that SWATKATS has been completely left off - even in the > technical categories? Get this, the Emmy crowd nominated "Two Stupid > Dogs" in a couple of categories, but ignored the 'KATS. What were the categories? (I prefer the art direction and design of _2 Stupid Dogs_). > I was hoping that at least the voice artists would make it into some > category, but the nomination roll has only listed "name" stars like Lily > Tomlin and Tim Curry - "work for a living" guys like Tress MacNeille, > Barry Gordon and Charlie Adler were totally ignored. This pissed off a > lot of people in the industry, so it's likely to change next year. Who'd it piss off? Besides, "work for a living" guys have been nominated (and won) in the past -- witness Dan Castellaneta. -- [Emru Townsend is also : Grown-ups never understand anything ] [emru@cam.org, switch@bix.com, : by themselves, and it is tiresome ] [and on Fidonet at 1:167/133 : for children to be always and forever] [URL: http://www.cam.org/~emru/ : explaining things to them. ] From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 11 21:48:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA17654 for kats-ll; Tue, 11 Apr 1995 21:48:48 -0400 Message-Id: <9504120149.AA24827@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 18:51:01 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Kat stuff content-length: 1826 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I just revised the introductory message that people get when subscribing to the list (send email to 'majordomo@lists.mv.net' with the line 'info kats' in the message body to read it). Andy Hill writes: > Out of the four, T-Bone and Razor are the best - they've got some >"extra stuff" on their flight-harnesses, but are otherwise good >likenesses of what's seen on the show. Dr. Viper is also quite good, >although he's been made without his lab-coat, and DarkKat, though good, >doesn't much resemble the TV version - although all the action >figures/artwork has been approved by H-B and the Tremblay bros. I'm definitely looking forward to this stuff when it comes out. The only thing I can guess that would be the "extra" stuff that T-Bone and Razor have on their flight harnesses would be jet packs (which they actually used at least once -- the episode "Caverns of Horror" springs to mind). Viper *without* a lab coat? That'd make him naked, wouldn't it? > A friend has conducted an interview with John Zuker, the guy pretty > much responsible for the music in the show, and he explains where the >inspiration for the Queen/Heavy Metal sound came from. I've been told that the music sounds like it's all synth material. Even if it is, it still sounds pretty awesome in stereo (I've been spoiled by stereo ;-). Also, while I still remember... for anyone on this list who's interested in joining a SWAT Kats fan club, please email me (or, preferably, Walt Koziol, another Kats list member, email: wkoziol@delphi.com) with your snail mail address. Let's make this club a reality! -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Good thing we had some paint left over, Jake..." "Aw, Chance... next time you get mad at the TV, why not try turning it off?!" From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 09:57:24 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA18971 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 09:57:21 -0400 Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 06:58:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "Whatever happened to 'Thanks for the Backup" To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I noticed some of the list dwellers have been posting stuff to rec.arts.animation lately - good job guys. I'm going to call Hanna-Barbera to find out who this Turner guy is that's reading the list - but I've heard that some "others" in their marketing org are also reading. Can I ask a favour? I posted a "challenge" to the Turner group on r.a.a. to make some kind of public statement regarding the 'KATS cancellation. If anyone feels inclined, and I won't be put out if no one does, could you post a couple of followups saying something like "yeah, how 'bout it?". Marketing people understand numbers, if they see more than one it gets their attention. I'm still trying to substantiate an e-mail I got that formed the basis of that post - but it sounds for real. I won't go into it now in case it's bull. Lastly, I copied off the articles concerning the SWATKATS and forwarded them to the Tremblay brothers, and they'll also go to Hanna-Barbera. I won't do the same for list stuff unless I get permission from the authors, as this isn't really a public group like r.a.a. is. There's going to be a few more JPEGS and GIF's available in the next couple of days for the KATS, I'll let you know when they make it through all the digitizing hoops. Andy ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 10:04:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA19016 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 10:04:55 -0400 Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 07:05:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch (fwd) To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: For the benefit of list memebers, here's what I sent to Margaret Loesch upon the suggestion of an industry type. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 3 Apr 1995 08:22:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill To: foxnet@delphi.com Subject: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch Ms. Margaret Loesch April 2, 1995 President, Fox Children's Network Dear Margaret, After reading your comments over the years regarding Kids programming, it appears we think much along the same lines regarding quality animation, and the importance of not underestimating the audience. The Fox lineup for strip programs and Sat-AM weekly's just gets better and better, and you've just about single-handedly created the crossover viewership for programs like Animaniacs, The Tick, and BTAS - all of which represent respect for the level of intelligence of your viewership. Fox seems to seize opportunities when they're recognized - so here's one you may have missed. Hanna-Barbera has created an excellent cartoon called "SWATKATS: The Radical Squadron" - they have 23 episodes ready to air and a further three have already had voice tracks laid down and 'boards done. Turner phoned in the cancellation order to H-B in the middle of the second season's 13 eps, and evidently plans to yank it off TBS shortly. The merchandising agreements/production are all in place for action figures, a SuperNintendo video game, and home video releases; all of which are timed for a July release to Toys 'R' Us and Target. I've talked with some industry people, legions of fans, and the individuals responsible for creating the program - which is why you're reading this. Turner's already done all the work for you, the show has good numbers, and if someone like Fox gives is a stable Sat-AM timeslot it will take off. You have your own sources - I'd expect no less for a "Cartoon Lady" - but Turner's attitude toward the program has nothing to do with business reasoning, and I can't say how I know that. From what I've seen, this fall is shaping up to be pretty weak in the action-adventure end of things, and if you can gamble with "StreetSharks", you can bet you won't regret snapping up SWATKATS. FYI, I'm not "getting anything out of this" other than doing what I can to help out all the people Turner has no regard for - most of whom already watch Fox Kids lineup for the same reasons they watch SWATKATS. I don't know if it was shopped around at NATPE, but if you want any more info without making your interest public through "official" channels - I can put you in touch with the creators, and stacks of fan mail. Thanks from a fellow animation fan, who also recognizes quality product. Andy Hill 12545 25th Ave phone days: (604) 875-1267 Surrey, B.C. phone eves: (604) 535-2901 Canada fax 24 hrs: (604) 875-1620 V4A 2K2 e-mail: chance@unix.inforserve.net (this will be copied to the regular post) ******************** Dear Ted Turner: ********************************* :"You know, cancelling SWATKATS after advertising new eps shows us that the shoes of Messrs. Hanna and Barbera have been unoccupied far too long" : "Why's that?" :"...someone in the organization has developed 'cold feet' ". From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 12:40:57 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA19663 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 12:40:53 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f8c02ce1c15002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Wed, 12 Apr 95 11:41:50 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "Whatever happened to 'Thanks for the Backup" Content-Length: 440 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On a similar note, I just posted a couple pics of Callie Briggs on alt.binaries.pictures.cartoons, and I'll be posting a couple more in a day or two. If someone on the list doesn't get that newsgroup, let me know and I can e-mail them to you. -Tim Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" -Percival McLeach From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 20:09:47 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA21770 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 20:09:38 -0400 Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 20:10:02 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch (fwd) To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: You must really like Swat Kats. Many people at My school say X-men can beat the Swat Kats any day.. But i don't qutie belive that. Matmilam "Let's Hit IT" From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 21:30:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA22174 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 21:30:15 -0400 Message-Id: <9504130131.AA14263@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 18:32:35 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Kat Stats... content-length: 1148 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I know the _Kats_ list is still growing, but I thought I'd try this anyway. I'm taking a poll of the list to get a feel for its demographics: (1) Gender (male/female) (2) Age (optional) (3) Occupation (like what do you do for a living? ;-) - if student, grade or college status (4) City and State (province or country) of residence (5) Number of people in your household (include yourself) (6) - How many people of your household (again, include yourself) watch: (a) cartoons in general? (b) SWAT Kats? (7) Any other interests or hobbies (sports, etc)? (8) What other mailing lists are you on? (I recognize a few subscribers as being on at least one other mailing list that I'm on.) (9) Anything else that I forgot in this survey? Please email replies *directly* to me, not to the list (I don't want the list being flooded with replies). I'll compile the responses and send the results to the list. Participation in the survey is, of course, voluntary. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone, if you drown... I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 12 23:03:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA22382 for kats-ll; Wed, 12 Apr 1995 23:03:13 -0400 From: August Yang Message-Id: <199504130304.XAA09222@ritz.mordor.com> Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 23:04:34 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Matthew b Milam" at Apr 12, 95 08:10:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1269 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Many people at My school say X-men can beat the Swat Kats any day.. In terms of what? Writing? They don't have any decent writers and they try to cram too much into a single episode with two minutes of character development and twenty of flash and mutant angst. I get enough of that in the comics which are better written anyway. In term of raw power? (i.e. If the SWAT Kats fought the X-men, Ho'od Win?) This is a case of "my superhero can beat up your superhero" which I would like to think we're above that. > But i don't qutie belive that. Good for you! I feel that the SWAT Kats are more interesting and inspiring than the X-men anyway. Speaking of which, I've been kicking ideas around for some fanfic, but I want to know if I ever finish it and want to put it on the mailing-list should I post a warning? I don't know if anyone from H-B reads this group, and if they do I'd like to avoid legal hassles. August Paul Yang thinks there are too many lawyers in the creative process -- wntrmute@ritz.mordor.com | For my Life Public Relations and Official Test Audience for the FDC | Still ahead, "Have you any idea how successful censorship is on TV? | Pity me. -Queen Don't know the answer? Hm. Successful. Isn't it?" -Max Headroom From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 09:14:52 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23454 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 09:14:47 -0400 Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 06:16:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch (fwd) To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 12 Apr 1995, Matthew b Milam wrote: > You must really like Swat Kats. > > Many people at My school say X-men can beat the Swat Kats any day.. > > But i don't qutie belive that. > > Matmilam > > "Let's Hit IT" Yeah, I really like 'em. I've been watching cartoons forever and there aren't that many good ones on where the characters have actual personalities. SWATKATS went through a lot of trouble to make sure the show respected its audience, and didn't cheap out believing it was "just a bunch of dumb kids watching". A lot of that has to do with the people who created the show; they're like me, and probably a lot of us - "big kids" who don't have a lot of use for what everyone else seems to adore, like "Melrose Place". The problem here is that Ted Turner, who fired the people who made the show, doesn't respect all us guys watching and lies to cover his tracks - what an example to set for the kids who watch the show. How many people want to grow up to be like Razor and T-Bone? How many want to grow up to be like Ted Turner? Nuff Said. By the way, I think the only battlefield the X-Men can trash the SWATKATS right now is the Neilsens. (sorry, "in-joke" Matthew, e-mail me and I'll explain it if you don't get it). Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 09:47:59 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23652 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 09:47:58 -0400 Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 06:49:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504130304.XAA09222@ritz.mordor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 12 Apr 1995, August Yang wrote: > > Many people at My school say X-men can beat the Swat Kats any day.. > In terms of what? Writing? They don't have any decent writers and they > try to cram too much into a single episode with two minutes of character > development and twenty of flash and mutant angst. I get enough of that > in the comics which are better written anyway. August Yang has nailed it in a single sentence. You can't have any kind of character development if the protagonists are bulletproof like the X-Men, instead of any kind of real emotion-driven character interaction, all you get is attitude being slung all over the place randomly. It's tiring, it's boring, and its increasingly prevalent in ac/adv. Just caught "Razor's Edge", although scrambled due to Pay-TV, I could see it plainly enough. I've seen similar plots attempted on other shows, but you get to see so much of Razor's character revealed here, something that must have been quite the argument with the producers when it was tossed around at the development stage - most of those people subscribe to the Marvel definition of hero characters: " they have to be invincible and they always have to win". > In term of raw power? (i.e. If the SWAT Kats fought the X-men, Ho'od Win?) > This is a case of "my superhero can beat up your superhero" which I would > like to think we're above that. The appreciation for the show/characters can either be expressed in terms like a lot of us do, or in terms like the guy above. I don't think that one is more valid than the other - it just represents a different perspective in regards to environment. > > But i don't qutie belive that. > Good for you! I feel that the SWAT Kats are more interesting and > inspiring than the X-men anyway. Speaking of which, I've been kicking > ideas around for some fanfic, but I want to know if I ever finish it and > want to put it on the mailing-list should I post a warning? I don't know > if anyone from H-B reads this group, and if they do I'd like to avoid > legal hassles. > > August Paul Yang thinks there are too many lawyers in the creative process August Paul Yang is correct, lawyers run everything in Hollywood. "Inspiring"? In the last few years for action-adventure, TMNT and SWATKATS have done more to revolutionize the "hero-toon" thing than even most Hollywood execs have realized. I hope their "wake-up" call comes quickly enough to get 'KATS rolling again. Fanfic? I've been following similar concerns regarding Animaniacs fanfiction, and the deal is that you can write whatever you want in terms of fan-related stuff, as long as you don't make money off of it. Watch the explicit stuff if you're into that either on GIF's or text - without an appropriate forewarning. H-B employees (to my knowledge) aren't on the group as of yet - and any that are likely to join in the next little while wouldn't mind fanfic one bit. I've even got a fairly good script idea I might turn into a story if I get a minute! Later From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 15:55:43 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id PAA25349 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 15:55:40 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch In-reply-to: Your message of Thu, 13 Apr 1995 09:49:29 EDT. Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 15:56:04 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr13.155652edt.45470@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill: > H-B employees (to my knowledge) aren't on > the group as of yet - and any that are likely to join in the next little > while wouldn't mind fanfic one bit. urm, the other half of the lawyers problem is that employees need to actively avoid being contaminated by story ideas, because a fan might decide to sue because their idea was stolen. whether or not there's merit to the claim, the possibility of an expensive lawsuit is enough to trigger heavy protective measures. -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 18:10:20 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA26054 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 18:10:20 -0400 Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 18:10:34 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch (fwd) To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I had read somewhere that The only H-b cartoon he liked was Captain Planet beacuse it wasn't violent. Matmilam On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, Andy Hill wrote: > > > On Wed, 12 Apr 1995, Matthew b Milam wrote: > > > You must really like Swat Kats. > > > > Many people at My school say X-men can beat the Swat Kats any day.. > > > > But i don't qutie belive that. > > > > Matmilam > > > > "Let's Hit IT" > > Yeah, I really like 'em. I've been watching cartoons forever and there > aren't that many good ones on where the characters have actual personalities. > SWATKATS went through a lot of trouble to make sure the show respected > its audience, and didn't cheap out believing it was "just a bunch of dumb > kids watching". A lot of that has to do with the people who created the > show; they're like me, and probably a lot of us - "big kids" who don't > have a lot of use for what everyone else seems to adore, like "Melrose > Place". The problem here is that Ted Turner, who fired the people who > made the show, doesn't respect all us guys watching and lies to cover his > tracks - what an example to set for the kids who watch the show. How > many people want to grow up to be like Razor and T-Bone? How many want > to grow up to be like Ted Turner? Nuff Said. > > By the way, I think the only battlefield the X-Men can trash the > SWATKATS right now is the Neilsens. (sorry, "in-joke" Matthew, e-mail me > and I'll explain it if you don't get it). > > Andy > From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 22:52:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA27136 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 22:52:05 -0400 From: August Yang Message-Id: <199504140253.WAA08845@ritz.mordor.com> Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 22:53:40 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 13, 95 06:49:29 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1133 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Somebody (sorry, I lost your name) wrote: > Just caught "Razor's Edge", although scrambled due to Pay-TV, I could see > it plainly enough. WHAT?!?!? AUGH!! That was a title of one of my fanfic ideas! Not only that, but there's a SWAT Kats episode out there that I seem to have missed! When was it on and when (and where) do you think I could catch it? (Plot synopsis wouldn't hurt either...) > "Inspiring"? In the last few years for action-adventure, TMNT and > SWATKATS have done more to revolutionize the "hero-toon" thing than even > most Hollywood execs have realized. SWAT Kats, I'll give you but TMNT? I was a fan of the Eastman and Laird comic book, but when I saw the "kiddified" version on the TV I nearly gagged. Ah well, I'm more into the idea of "hero-furries" anyway. August Paul Yang hopes that people know what a furry is. If not he'll explain -- wntrmute@ritz.mordor.com | For my Life Public Relations and Official Test Audience for the FDC | Still ahead, "Have you any idea how successful censorship is on TV? | Pity me. -Queen Don't know the answer? Hm. Successful. Isn't it?" -Max Headroom From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 13 23:50:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA27293 for kats-ll; Thu, 13 Apr 1995 23:50:55 -0400 Message-Id: <9504140352.AA02341@cisk> Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Thu, 13 Apr 95 20:52:28 PDT In-Reply-To: <199504140253.WAA08845@ritz.mordor.com> from "August Yang" at Apr 13, 95 10:53:40 pm From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1714 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: August Yang writes: > > Just caught "Razor's Edge", although scrambled due to Pay-TV, I could see > > it plainly enough. > WHAT?!?!? AUGH!! That was a title of one of my fanfic ideas! Not only > that, but there's a SWAT Kats episode out there that I seem to have missed! > When was it on and when (and where) do you think I could catch it? (Plot > synopsis wouldn't hurt either...) "Razor's Edge" was on just this past weekend. Here's a brief synopsis (no spoilers): While in pursuit of Dark Kat, Razor fires two octopus missiles, which miss Dark Kat and hit an abandoned warehouse. The warehouse explodes, and in the ensuing confusion Dark Kat manages to escape. However, two innocent civilians get hurt, leaving Razor very shaken and upset. In their next meeting with Dark Kat, this almost gets deadly, as Dark Kat uses Razor's loss of self-confidence to nearly destroy the Turbokat. Does Razor get his confidence back? That's the rest of the episode, but I won't go into details (otherwise it'll spoil the episode for those who haven't seen it). > SWAT Kats, I'll give you but TMNT? I was a fan of the Eastman and Laird > comic book, but when I saw the "kiddified" version on the TV I nearly gagged. > Ah well, I'm more into the idea of "hero-furries" anyway. Check out this season's TMNT (and I mean the actual 1994 episodes, not other episodes with the 1994 opening credits). There's no mention of pizza, and the foursome have really grown up. But perhaps Barry Gordon's better suited to voice an anthrofeline than an anthropomorphic turtle. ;-) -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone, if you drown... I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 12:47:54 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA29266 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 12:47:51 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 09:50:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr13.155652edt.45470@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > urm, the other half of the lawyers problem is that employees need to > actively avoid being contaminated by story ideas, because a fan might > decide to sue because their idea was stolen. whether or not there's > merit to the claim, the possibility of an expensive lawsuit is enough > to trigger heavy protective measures. Most creative folks share your distate of lawyers, but don't worry about this particular concern - such lawsuits are rarely successful, as evidenced recently by the George Lucas/Ewoks thing, and one of the challenges to Michael Jackson regarding a song idea. For example, alt.tv.animaniacs has many, many lurkers from Warner Bros. - I talk to a couple, it hasn't been a problem. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 12:58:13 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA29321 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 12:58:00 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 10:00:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Citizen Ted: Captain Planet in disguise? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, Matthew b Milam wrote: > I had read somewhere that The only H-b cartoon he liked was Captain > Planet beacuse it wasn't violent. > > Matmilam Bingo! There's a nasty thing called the "DIC code", which essentially translates into "if it's effective against evil, you don't get to use it in a cartoon". Turner's favourite cartoon is, for a fact, "Captain Planet and the Planeteers", which is in, what - it's sixth season? This cartoon and stuff like it will likely soon be all that we can watch, if the code to which it adheres becomes more of an industry standard that it already is. A fellow mailing list dweller tells me that Turner spent one-tenth of Hanna-Barbera's entire operating budget on SWATKATS, which seems at odds with what he's doing with the program now. It also seems peculiar when you hear something like that next to what I get in my mailbox from people who don't leave names - like "Turner hates the program", and "He cancelled it because he suddenly realized how violent it actually was". I'm still waiting for a call back from Hanna-Barbera to help clear up the circumstances regarding it's cancellation, but I think they've been told not to talk to us - I normally get called back the same day. Andy (not paranoid, just observant...) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 13:12:07 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA29447 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 13:12:06 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 10:14:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504140253.WAA08845@ritz.mordor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, August Yang wrote: > Somebody (sorry, I lost your name) wrote: WHAT?!?!? AUGH!! (my name's Andy, my nick's Chance) > SWAT Kats, I'll give you but TMNT? I was a fan of the Eastman and Laird > comic book, but when I saw the "kiddified" version on the TV I nearly gagged. I was more referring to the types of characters the Turtles and the SWATKATS were, as opposed to some of the Turtle cartoons themselves. I missed all of the "grittier ones" because our CBS affiliate and Canada in general dropped them. For the record, the best example of TMNT's character show's up in the first feature movie, the B&W comix till about '89, and apparently the current season of the cartoon. > Ah well, I'm more into the idea of "hero-furries" anyway. > August Paul Yang hopes that people know what a furry is. If not he'll > explain You might have to. The definition seems to widely range depending on the company you keep. I find the definitions in the FurryFAQ to be clear enough, but not everyone's read that. I've only recently been made aware of the whole "Furry"-thing, but all the characters I like seem to fall within the general parameters. Go fig. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 13:53:46 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA29956 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 13:53:44 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f8eb6fc6d81002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Fri, 14 Apr 95 12:55:08 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Citizen Ted: Captain Planet in disguise? Content-Length: 896 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, Matthew b Milam wrote: >There's a nasty thing called the "DIC code", which essentially translates >into "if it's effective against evil, you don't get to use it in a cartoon". >Turner's favourite cartoon is, for a fact, "Captain Planet and the >Planeteers", which is in, what - it's sixth season? This cartoon and >stuff like it will likely soon be all that we can watch, if the code to >which it adheres becomes more of an industry standard that it already is. Captain Planet has only been on the air a few years, and I don't think any new episodes have been made in a while. The reason Turner keeps pushing the series is because he created the show himself (in one of his fits of social-consciousness -- let's hope he remains socially- unconscious from now on :) ). That's why this show stays on the air when it should have been canceled a long time ago. -Tim From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 16:42:17 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id QAA01452 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 16:42:15 -0400 Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 10:43:50 -1000 (HST) From: Jonathan Tomohiko Higa X-Sender: higa@newton To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: For Fox Kids Network:Margaret Loesch In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 Apr 1995, Andy Hill wrote: > On Thu, 13 Apr 1995, August Yang wrote: > > SWAT Kats, I'll give you but TMNT? I was a fan of the Eastman and Laird > > comic book, but when I saw the "kiddified" version on the TV I nearly gagged. > > I was more referring to the types of characters the Turtles and the > SWATKATS were, as opposed to some of the Turtle cartoons themselves. I > missed all of the "grittier ones" because our CBS affiliate and Canada in > general dropped them. For the record, the best example of TMNT's > character show's up in the first feature movie, the B&W comix till about > '89, and apparently the current season of the cartoon. First of all, I should scold both of you for running off-topic. Until there is a TMNT list, you will have to reserve discussion of this type to e-mail or newsgroups. Don't claim to have the "best example" when you are admitted to being in the dark. You undercut your own statement. I have more to say on this issue, but I shall do so by other means. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 17:41:54 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA02062 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 17:41:53 -0400 From: August Yang Message-Id: <199504142143.RAA12051@ritz.mordor.com> Subject: But I Digress... To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 17:43:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 934 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: First off, let me apologize for straying a little off topic. Strange thoughts tend to creep into my head late at night. (Hence why I'm posting during the day this time.) Br) Next, Ah, so that's Razor's Edge. I have seen that one, but either my VCR cut off the title screen or my memory's getting faulty. Thanks for the synopsis, Dana! (Still have to think up a new title though Br) Also, for me, a "furry" is *any* zoomorphic animal. This includes lizards, birds, etc. that do not have fur. Easier for me to lump 'em all together. And if this is considered way off topic again let me apologize in advance. August Paul Yang continues to work on his fanfic -- wntrmute@ritz.mordor.com | For my Life Public Relations and Official Test Audience for the FDC | Still ahead, "Have you any idea how successful censorship is on TV? | Pity me. -Queen Don't know the answer? Hm. Successful. Isn't it?" -Max Headroom From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 18:01:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA02181 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 18:01:10 -0400 Message-Id: <9504142202.AA12607@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 15:04:01 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: administrivia content-length: 1221 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: All right, folks. Let's keep this discussion to SWAT Kats material as much as possible. The list was created for that purpose, and stuff like FOX Kids Network, TMNT and Captain Planet are sufficiently off-topic that they shouldn't be commented on by themselves. As I see it, there's nothing wrong with commenting on these topics on the side, *provided* the majority of your post is still on-topic. You can argue a comparison between Ted Turner's decision to cancel SWAT Kats versus keeping a show like Captain Planet, but once the topic starts to drift to nothing *but* comments about Captain Planet it directs the entire list off topic. Also, I still see at least one of you out there who is quoting an entire message and including only one or two lines of original comments. As I said at least once before, don't do this as it takes up too much bandwidth. If your mail reader won't let you do this (and most, if not all, mail readers have editing features) then please send *me* the message you want to post and I'll edit and post it myself. Comments, questions and flames to me via email, please. Do NOT followup to the list. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 14 18:46:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA04056 for kats-ll; Fri, 14 Apr 1995 18:46:21 -0400 Message-Id: <9504142247.AA13162@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Apr 1995 15:49:08 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Edgy Razors... content-length: 1040 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: OK, I've taken a bit of time to cool off here. After looking back at the list material, I don't think the off-topic digressions were bad enough to warrant my last posting to the list. Even the other part about including quoted text hasn't happened more than a couple of isolated times; however, please keep my admonitions in mind for future reference. BTW, my poll is shaping up. The age ranges appear to be roughly 20 to 42 and as far as I can tell there aren't any female list members (at least none that *responded* to my poll, anyway ;-) and quite a bit of you are on another list that I'm on (some more as lurkers than others). My general comment about "Razor's Edge" -- good episode, although predictable. You can tell basically what's going to happen after Act I, although how exactly the story is resolved isn't as predictable. It does have some very good characterization on Razor's part (and even a little on T-Bone, tho moreso on Razor). -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 15 13:27:29 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA07177 for kats-ll; Sat, 15 Apr 1995 13:27:18 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 1995 10:30:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504142247.AA13162@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > OK, I've taken a bit of time to cool off here. After looking back at the Dana's allowed. We wouldn't have anything to read if he hadn't set the list up. No prob. > BTW, my poll is shaping up. The age ranges appear to be roughly 20 to 42 > and as far as I can tell there aren't any female list members (at least > none that *responded* to my poll, anyway ;-) and quite a bit of you are on > another list that I'm on (some more as lurkers than others). Callie Briggs, if you're out there in any form, Dana needs your stats for the list. Actually, I'd heard something somewhere about most of the show's fans being male, despite the effort that went into making the characters appealing to women. But the simple fact of Usenet is that there are far more men than women on board. The other mailing list wouldn't happen to be "S***ic the H*****og", would it? (Deftly avoiding another off-topic comment - grin!) > My general comment about "Razor's Edge" -- good episode, although > predictable. You can tell basically what's going to happen after Act I, > although how exactly the story is resolved isn't as predictable. It does > have some very good characterization on Razor's part (and even a little on > T-Bone, tho moreso on Razor). Yeah, I saw this one scrambled, but could see enough to agree with much of the above. I personally didn't catch on that Octopus missiles didn't explode with that kind of force, though I had suspected the "innocent citizens" weren't as innocent as made out. I followed up on this with someone I know concerning why more of these types of "character development" stories weren't done...it's in the next post. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 15 13:52:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA07452 for kats-ll; Sat, 15 Apr 1995 13:52:55 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 1995 10:56:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "Razor's Edge", Lance Falk and Giant Monsters To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Had an interesting phone call yesterday, here's the short version of it - I'll actually have a proof of the article shortly (I think I said that before, but there's been a few delays beyond my control). For those of you who don't know who "Lance Falk" is, he was part of the SwatKats design team and wrote some great episodes. Lance Falk's favourite eps were "The Metallikats", "Metal Urgency" and "Unlikely Alloys", as he liked the B-Movie gangster dialogue and interaction between the Mac and Molly Mange characters. Lance tried to make his episodes grow out of the frictions between the character's personalities, and had little use for characters which existed strictly for "comic relief", like Burke and Murray. In "Metal Urgency", Lance had only written in the scene with these two and the SwatKats simply so he would have the opportunity to meet Mark Hamill! Lance had always tried to write episodes that focused on character development as opposed to simple battles with Large Monsters, but was always held back in his pursuit of such stories by people in the managment team at H-B/Turner who insisted on reminding him that the audience was " 10 yr. olds". Villains were usually portrayed as giant entities of Pure Evil, something else that Lance wanted to avoid - hoping that there would eventually be room for semi-sympathetic villains, perhaps with a tragic back-story (like future planned appearances of Rexx Shard). He managed to combine aspects of both in his "Unlikely Alloys" (the last ep completed - I haven't seen it) - creating the largest monster yet conceived to appease the execs who wanted that kind of thing, but also factoring in Mac and Molly in a less than totally villainous way. It seemed that some forces at play in Hanna-Barbera failed to recognize the potential of more three-dimensional bad-guys in the afternoon format (as are often found in Batman:The Animated Series), and had more episodes been produced we would likely have seen more characters of this type. Lance also pointed to Mark Saraceni's "Razor's Edge" as having some of the character development aspects he wanted to expand upon, but the cancellation of the program robbed him of the chance. He's working for Warner's now, and I hope his contract leaves him free to write the script for the SwatKats movie, should it ever be produced. Interesting note about "Razor's Edge", the writer - Mark Saraceni - is co-designer of H-B's "Two Stupid Dogs", and has written eps for Warner's "Taz". Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 15 16:14:13 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id QAA07625 for kats-ll; Sat, 15 Apr 1995 16:14:12 -0400 Message-Id: <9504152016.AA02548@cisk> Subject: Kat Weaponry and Edgy Razors... To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Sat, 15 Apr 95 13:16:03 PDT From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1447 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill writes: > On Fri, 14 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > > > OK, I've taken a bit of time to cool off here. After looking back at the > > Dana's allowed. We wouldn't have anything to read if he hadn't set > the list up. No prob. Let me clarify something here. The *idea* of the mailing list was my idea, yes. However, Paul Hurley (aka Ratman) did the legwork in setting up the actual mailing list (I believe in giving credit where credit is due), although I help take care of its administrative tasks. > I personally didn't catch on that Octopus missiles didn't explode with > that kind of force, though I had suspected the "innocent citizens" > weren't as innocent as made out. As far as I know, the Octopus Missile doesn't even explode. It simply releases metal arms while in flight to grab its target (and it comes in all sizes, apparently). It's not equipped with any warheads (and you may have noticed that quite a bit of the Kats' weaponry isn't equipped with warheads, like the Spider Missile, Octopus Missile, Cement Launcher, Slicer Missile, and so on). That doesn't mean, of course, that the Kats' weaponry doesn't include *any* warheads; but the intent of the weaponry seems to be more toward capturing or disabling criminals rather than blowing them up. Any comments? -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 15 16:21:46 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id QAA07648 for kats-ll; Sat, 15 Apr 1995 16:21:46 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Sat, 15 Apr 1995 16:23:41 -0400 Message-Id: <199504152023.QAA04903@unix1.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Kat Weaponry, if not edgy razors Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Kat Weaponry, the preferred mode of action thereof: Indeed, most of the weaponry they possess is designed to capture or disable. Remember, these fellows are former police officers and thus have respect for the law (if not those who enforce the law). Not only that, if their weapons killed their intended targets, there would be a legal rationale for having them arrested on sight. And, of course, the writers would have to think up brand-new villains each week. :) ----- Samuel Conway, Ph.D. Senior Mad Scientist Avid Therapeutics Philadelphia, PA flogistn@netaxs.com From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 15 17:36:37 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA07840 for kats-ll; Sat, 15 Apr 1995 17:36:36 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 1995 17:36:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Kat Weaponry and Edgy Razors... In-Reply-To: <9504152016.AA02548@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 15 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > > Dana's allowed. We wouldn't have anything to read if he hadn't set > > the list up. No prob. > > Let me clarify something here. > The *idea* of the mailing list was my idea, yes. However, Paul Hurley > (aka Ratman) did the legwork in setting up the actual mailing list (I > believe in giving credit where credit is due), although I help take > care of its administrative tasks. Yeah. What he said. :-) To clarify, you do ALL the administrative tasks. I just created the list and helped where I could with the technical side. You really are the driving force behind this thing. I just push the buttons. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 10:34:52 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA11599 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 10:34:50 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 1995 07:38:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Kat Weaponry and Edgy Razors... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504152016.AA02548@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 15 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Andy Hill writes: > > Let me clarify something here. > The *idea* of the mailing list was my idea, yes. However, Paul Hurley > (aka Ratman) did the legwork in setting up the actual mailing list (I > believe in giving credit where credit is due), although I help take > care of its administrative tasks. Actually, I was aware of that (thanks Paul), but I also believe I gave credit where it was due, just not everywhere it was due. > Slicer Missile, and so on). That doesn't mean, of course, that the Kats' > weaponry doesn't include *any* warheads; but the intent of the weaponry > seems to be more toward capturing or disabling criminals rather than > blowing them up. Any comments? I noted that most of their weaponry seems more geared towards stopping the particular miscreants in their tracks, without necessarily passing "judgement" on them by blowing them to smithereens. When I first saw the show, I figured it was due to the whole "anti-violence" bit, but later eps proved that wasn't necessarily the case. In "Bride of the Pastmaster", Razor attempts to "stop" T-Bone's "oil-suckin' eel" from it's attack on the tanker with a "pincer missile", and only resorts to the "matchhead" one as a last resort - sort of like a limited response tactic in a military scenario. Of course, the "Match-head missile" turns the worm into mush ("we just had the TurboKat washed!.."), but he tried the civilized way first. The best example of this (IMO) in their weapons inventory is the "scrambler missile", which shorts out all of the weapons/control systems on the villains craft, yet would usually allow for a forced landing. Still, not even this is applied evenly, they used it on Hard-Drive in the Behemoth tank, allowing it simply to crash into a building, but after T-Bone used it on DarkKat - he then fired an explosive missile to finish him off (likely because he wanted revenge for what he assumed to be Razor's sure demise in that ep, "Wrath of DarkKat"). You'll note that though they try to be balanced, they don't have a problem with "getting the job done", and some of the darker humour associated with that theme makes it into the show - note what's scrawled on the "plain old missile" in "Chaos in Crystal": "From Razor With Love" A take on similar slogans from WWII and the conflict in Southeast Asia. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 11:23:11 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA11710 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 11:23:10 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 1995 08:27:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: In late 1993, TBS was unscrambled on our Pay-TV for the entire week between Christmas and NewYears, fortunate for me because they played SWATKATS every day, and that's where I got most of my canned eps from. At the end of the program, they invited you to "tell us what you think" - and I did, writing them a kind of "kiddified" letter to try and get my comments aired along with the rest. I addressed the letter to "SWATKATS HEAQUARTERS", and actually got a reply with "SWATKATS HEADQUARTERS" on the outside of the envelope - even their postal meter imprinted the postage stamp with the "SwatKats" logo! The letter was on a white piece of paper, with a faint blue representation of the TurboKat's cockpit interior visible beneath the writing. The logo "SwatKats: The Radical Squadron" was in colour at the top, and the bottom had the familiar colour "Hanna-Barbera/Grinning T-Bone" logo at the bottom. The text went like this: Dear Andy: >From the depths of Megakat City, T-Bone and Razor asked me to thank you for your letter and interest in SWAT Kats: The Radical Squadron. When called by Callie Briggs to defend justice and operate their jet fighters (sic), T-Bone and Razor need your support. They're glad you like the show! Here's a secret from the confidential files of the SWAT Kats. Did you know T-Bone and Razor like television too? T-Bone likes Scaredy Kat cartoons, and Razor likes David Litterbin! Enclosed you will find a present from MegaKat city: an official SWAT Kats gift just for you. Keep watching Jake and Chance transform into T-Bone and Razor (ed:they got it backwards) while they conquer a vast array of evil villains - Sunday mornings on TBS or your local affiliate -- and learn all of their secrets yourself. Thanks again! Skippy Smith for T-Bone and Razor (a) (and its signed) The sticker is about the size of a standard envelope. It's a colour representation of the SWAT Kats logo, and is meant to be stuck on the inside of a car windshield - odd thing for a kids show. One has to wonder if "Skippy" is in fact Perry Smith, currently writing as a representative of Turner on rec.arts.animation; if so, he sure changed his tune - he's falling all over himself to answer "shorts" questions (I guess that's cool) but has ignored all us 'KAT people. One other person I know got a letter like the one above, I'd be interested in hearing of others. Last note, one of our list subscribers reports that Hanna-Barbera sold out of even the SWATKATS t-shirts some time ago, so much for "not buying enough SK merchandise". Andy ************************************************************************* "They say a smile, will do the trick.... with a little charm, laid on thick; but listen folks, forget those strokes - 'cause 'KATS always gets the short end of the stick!" (Rita - Animaniacs "Icebreakers" AN148) ************************************************************************ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 14:01:48 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id OAA12235 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 14:01:38 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f915bf65f64002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Sun, 16 Apr 95 13:03:34 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" Content-Length: 256 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy, I think what you got is a form letter that H-B sends out to everyone who writes to the SWAT KATS show. I saw a letter someone else got from the "SWATKATS HEADQUARTERS" (was it Dana or "Dr. Konway"?), and it contained the same text, verbatim. -Tim From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 14:12:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id OAA12276 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 14:12:13 -0400 Date: Sun, 16 Apr 1995 14:14:20 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" To: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <2f915bf65f64002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 Apr 1995 fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > Andy, > > I think what you got is a form letter that H-B sends out to everyone who > writes to the SWAT KATS show. I saw a letter someone else got from the > "SWATKATS HEADQUARTERS" (was it Dana or "Dr. Konway"?), and it contained > the same text, verbatim. > > -Tim > I think H-B is getting the impression that if they send phony letters that people will be happy. Matmilam From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 15:45:03 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id PAA12695 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 15:45:02 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f91743315ab002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Sun, 16 Apr 95 14:46:59 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" Content-Length: 594 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 Apr 1995 Matmilam wrote: >I think H-B is getting the impression that if they send phony letters >that people will be happy. I don't think they think that. It's nice whenever a company sends _anything_ back when they get fan mail. If they send out form letters, it probably means they're getting a _lot_ of mail. And I think that's a good thing for us SWAT KATS fans, no? :) -Tim ---- Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" -Percival McLeach From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 16 21:20:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA14737 for kats-ll; Sun, 16 Apr 1995 21:20:21 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Sun, 16 Apr 1995 21:22:31 -0400 Message-Id: <199504170122.VAA28784@unix1.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I did, indeed, send fanmail to the address at the end of the show, and got the exact same reply. But I received more later on! Apparently they got a chuckle out of a nice, formal later on U.S. Government letterhead that was signed "Dr. Samuel Conway, Senior Chemist, National Center for Toxicological Research" (my position at the time). So much so, that they forwarded it to the brothers Tremblay. Christian sent me a very nice letter in reply, in which he included a photocopy of a storyboard sketch for "Mutation City", along with a sketch of a character they'd created for that episode. They'd named it, much to my delight, "Dr. Konway". In that episode, he is a rather wimpy, skinny little biologist. I, myself, am a rather wimpy, skinny little chemist (ask Dana!). So they were close. The text of the letter that I sent to them, as well as the reply from the Tremblays, is available on request; I think I might also have a GIF of the "Dr. Konway" sketch around as well. ---- Dr. Samuel Conway Senior Drooling Demented Scientist Avid Therapeutics Philadelphia, PA flogistn@netaxs.com From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 05:08:33 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA16642 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 05:08:30 -0400 Message-Id: <9504170910.AA10972@cisk> Subject: Kat replies To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Mon, 17 Apr 95 2:10:45 PDT From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 2539 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I can see the list is nothing if not prolific. I'm also wondering if it's time to start up an FAQ file (for those of you who don't know what the acronym means, FAQ stands for Frequently Asked Questions). In any event, I've got a few comments on some listmail: Matmilan: I think H-B is getting the impression that if they send phony letters that people will be happy. Tim: I don't think they think that. It's nice whenever a company sends _anything_ back when they get fan mail. If they send out form letters, it probably means they're getting a _lot_ of mail. And I think that's a good thing for us SWAT KATS fans, no? :) What's funny about this is that when I sent out my original letter to the show, I was wondering what the response would be (this was somewhere in the summer of 1994 or so, after the first seasons' set of episodes had aired). Would I receive a response at all? Would it be a form letter? What exactly would the letter contain? And so on... Well, as it turned out I received the exact same letter that Andy said he received, but I was glad they at least acknowledged having received my letter. The other neat thing is that they seemed to listen to at least part of what I wrote. I had asked for a cast list of the show (being on two different mailing lists, and possibly a third? ;-) I've become an avid voice credit watcher) and while I didn't receive any in the mail, I *was* pleasantly surprised to see a cast list of all of the voices for each of the second season episodes. (Finding out that Charlie Adler voices T-Bone, for example, nearly floored me.) Dr. C(K?)onway: In ["Mutation City", Dr. Konway] is a rather wimpy, skinny little biologist. I, myself, am a rather wimpy, skinny little chemist (ask Dana!). So they were close. Well, not exactly. Konway turned out to be a very old, fat biochemist (employed at Megakat Biochemical) and voiced by none other than Jim Cummings. The text of the letter that I sent to them, as well as the reply from the Tremblays, is available on request; I think I might also have a GIF of the "Dr. Konway" sketch around as well. How about sending the letter and the text of the response from the Tremblays over to the list? I have the GIF (I just checked and yes, I still have it) that I can send over to the list as well. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 07:37:48 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id HAA16760 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 07:37:47 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 07:40:04 -0400 Message-Id: <199504171140.HAA02316@unix3.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Kat replies Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: -Dr. C(K?)onway: In ["Mutation City", Dr. Konway] is a rather wimpy, - skinny little biologist. I, myself, am a rather wimpy, - skinny little chemist (ask Dana!). So they were close. - -Well, not exactly. Konway turned out to be a very old, fat biochemist -(employed at Megakat Biochemical) and voiced by none other than Jim -Cummings. Bah! The original concept showed him being old and fat (like me), but the actual character looked decidedly more slender. And not at all as gruff. I was expecting a sort of feline Ernest Borgnine, but got instead more like a feline Woody Allen. -How about sending the letter and the text of the response from the -Tremblays over to the list? OK, OK, you've convinced me. Let me dig it up. -I have the GIF (I just checked and yes, I still have it) that I can -send over to the list as well. Deal. ------ Samuel Conway, Ph.D. Senior slouching hunchback Avid Thereapeutics, Inc. Philadelphia, PA flogistn@netaxs.com From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 11:59:45 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA17449 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 11:59:43 -0400 Message-Id: <9504171601.AA17695@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 23:03:36 -0600 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: sri_students@chapel.fcasd.edu (sri) Subject: Re: Kat Stats... Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >I know the _Kats_ list is still growing, but I thought I'd try this anyway. >I'm taking a poll of the list to get a feel for its demographics: > >(1) Gender (male/female) MALE >(2) Age (optional) 17 >(3) Occupation (like what do you do for a living? ;-) > - if student, grade or college status FOX CHAPEL HIGH SCHOOL GRADE 11 >(4) City and State (province or country) of residence Ineanola PA USA >(5) Number of people in your household (include yourself) 3 >(6) - How many people of your household (again, include yourself) watch: > (a) cartoons in general? 1 > (b) SWAT Kats? 1 >(7) Any other interests or hobbies (sports, etc)? COMIC COLLETING AND POGS >(8) What other mailing lists are you on? (I recognize a few subscribers as > being on at least one other mailing list that I'm on.) MK3 >(9) Anything else that I forgot in this survey? > >Please email replies *directly* to me, not to the list (I don't want the >list being flooded with replies). I'll compile the responses and send the >results to the list. > >Participation in the survey is, of course, voluntary. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 12:04:51 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA17488 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:04:50 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:04:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Kat Stats... In-Reply-To: <9504171601.AA17695@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: READ IT FOOL!!! On Mon, 17 Apr 1995, sri wrote: > >I know the _Kats_ list is still growing, but I thought I'd try this anyway. > >I'm taking a poll of the list to get a feel for its demographics: > > > >(1) Gender (male/female) > > MALE > >Please email replies *directly* to me, not to the list (I don't want the > >list being flooded with replies). I'll compile the responses and send the > >results to the list. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 12:08:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA17521 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:08:22 -0400 Message-Id: <9504171609.AA17703@hartwood.fcasd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 23:11:33 -0600 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: sri_students@chapel.fcasd.edu (sri) Subject: Re: Kat Stats... Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I made a mistake in mailing please ignore my last message. (How imparising) -Dan From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 12:43:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA17703 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:43:44 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 09:48:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <2f915bf65f64002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 Apr 1995 fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > Andy, > > I think what you got is a form letter that H-B sends out to everyone who > writes to the SWAT KATS show. I saw a letter someone else got from the > "SWATKATS HEADQUARTERS" (was it Dana or "Dr. Konway"?), and it contained > the same text, verbatim. Yep, you're right. I'd guess that their are three different versions or so, hence the (a) at the bottom, presumably there's a (b), (c) and perhaps even (d). The signature is part of the printing on the virgin paper, and the text is laser-printed on top of the whole thing. I do know one person who didn't get one of the form-letter responses, he actually got questions answered - but on the same paper apparently. Just a weird coincidence I chose to write "SWATKATS HEADQUARTERS", when no such creature exists on the show. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 12:48:48 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA17730 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:48:47 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 09:53:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: "Razor and T-Bone like TV too" To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504170122.VAA28784@unix1.netaxs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 Apr 1995 flogistn@netaxs.com wrote: > The text of the letter that I sent to them, as well as the reply from the > Tremblays, is available on request; I think I might also have a GIF of the > "Dr. Konway" sketch around as well. Consider it requested! I can't display GIF's on this machine (belongs in a tarpit) but maybe you could put it up in alt.pictures.binary.cartoons? One more thing, do you mind if I mention this to Christian Tremblay? He'll probably get a kick out of it too! Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 12:57:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA17836 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 12:57:31 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 10:02:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Kat replies To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504170910.AA10972@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Well, as it turned out I received the exact same letter that Andy said > he received, but I was glad they at least acknowledged having received > my letter. The other neat thing is that they seemed to listen to at > least part of what I wrote. I had asked for a cast list of the show > (being on two different mailing lists, and possibly a third? ;-) I've > become an avid voice credit watcher) and while I didn't receive any in > the mail, I *was* pleasantly surprised to see a cast list of all of the > voices for each of the second season episodes. (Finding out that Charlie > Adler voices T-Bone, for example, nearly floored me.) According to Victoria McCollum, who was/is Unit Production Manager on the 'KATS, any fanmail received at the 3400 Cahuenga Blvd. address gets 11 copies of it made and forwarded to different departments. One of the departments is the Tremblay brothers, and presumably one of the departments is responsible for answering questions (I have no idea what the other depts are, but you can bet one of them is "Marketing"). I also follow the voice credits of various shows, and although both Charlie Adler and Barry Gordon (T-Bone and Razor respectively) do variations on more-or-less the same type of voice, they're outstanding actors. Try and picture someone else doing the roles better, I know I can't. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 17 23:58:27 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA23205 for kats-ll; Mon, 17 Apr 1995 23:58:13 -0400 From: Doctor Enigma Message-Id: <199504180401.AAA26509@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 00:01:33 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 15, 95 10:30:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1118 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > > BTW, my poll is shaping up. The age ranges appear to be roughly 20 to 42 > > and as far as I can tell there aren't any female list members (at least > > none that *responded* to my poll, anyway ;-) and quite a bit of you are on > > another list that I'm on (some more as lurkers than others). > > Callie Briggs, if you're out there in any form, Dana needs your stats > for the list. Actually, I'd heard something somewhere about most of the > show's fans being male, despite the effort that went into making the > characters appealing to women. But the simple fact of Usenet is that > there are far more men than women on board. Actually, one of the first comments I made after seeing SWAT Kats was that it's a very male show. Lots of hard hitting action, loudness, and machismo. Anyone agree? -- [Emru Townsend is also : Grown-ups never understand anything ] [emru@cam.org, switch@bix.com, : by themselves, and it is tiresome ] [and on Fidonet at 1:167/133 : for children to be always and forever] [URL: http://www.cam.org/~emru/ : explaining things to them. ] From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 01:09:26 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA23417 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 01:09:25 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 19:11:45 -1000 (HST) From: Jonathan Tomohiko Higa X-Sender: higa@galois To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... In-Reply-To: <199504180401.AAA26509@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 18 Apr 1995, Doctor Enigma wrote: > Actually, one of the first comments I made after seeing SWAT Kats was that > it's a very male show. Lots of hard hitting action, loudness, and machismo. > Anyone agree? Whether I agree will depend on whether the definition of "male" is "containing lots of hard-hitting action, loudness, and machismo." Last time I checked, women were permitted into the military and perform the same great service to our country in active combat as perform men. Ah, I know. I must be misinterpreting the post. In the SWAT Kats world, he means that only males are permitted to be public defenders. Oh, no, wait, that's not right--Felina Feral's there. Hm. I guess I'm just an idiot; I can't figure out what he really meant. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ also known as "a rambling dunce who still needs to work on his sarcasm" From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 02:19:03 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA23707 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 02:19:02 -0400 Date: Mon, 17 Apr 1995 20:21:28 -1000 (HST) From: Jonathan Tomohiko Higa X-Sender: higa@galois To: SWAT Kats Mailing List Subject: Felina Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I don't know much about Lieutenant Felina Feral, except that she's a "good shot" (Mutation City). I have the impression that she's supposed to be one of the best Enforcers, the Commander's objections notwithstanding. Discuss. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ third post to the list, but my first constructive one (it's about time! I'm such an obnoxious brat) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 02:47:38 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA23775 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 02:47:38 -0400 Message-Id: <9504180650.AA29754@cisk> Subject: Re: Felina To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Mon, 17 Apr 95 23:50:02 PDT In-Reply-To: from "Jonathan Tomohiko Higa" at Apr 17, 95 08:21:28 pm From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 939 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Jonathan Higa writes: > I don't know much about Lieutenant Felina Feral, except that she's a > "good shot" (Mutation City). I have the impression that she's supposed > to be one of the best Enforcers, the Commander's objections > notwithstanding. Actually, even the Commander respects his niece, and it's not just because she's his niece (tho that is part of it). He once said, "I oughta throw that niece of mine off the force, except my brother would never speak to me again... and she's too good an Enforcer!" I remember some discussion coming up on rec.arts.animation about how someone thought that Felina was "too PC for me"... and I'm still wondering how Felina is PC (politically correct, for those of you who don't like acronyms). > I'm such an obnoxious brat) No comment. ;-) -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 08:55:35 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id IAA24386 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 08:55:33 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 06:01:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: 'KATS out of the bag...it's a guy show... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504180401.AAA26509@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 18 Apr 1995, Doctor Enigma wrote: > Actually, one of the first comments I made after seeing SWAT Kats was that > it's a very male show. Lots of hard hitting action, loudness, and machismo. > Anyone agree? Actually, SWATKATS, like most of the action adventure stuff, adheres to the Hollywood-ism that "little girls will watch programs geared to little boys, but not vice-versa". There's a lot of "guy-stuff" in the show, like some of the character interaction in "Top Gun", and they haven't gotten too carried away with exploring the romantic avenues open to them, like Callie Briggs. The closest I think they got so far was "Cry Turmoil", no? Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 09:02:53 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA24422 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:02:52 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 06:08:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Felina To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 Apr 1995, Jonathan Tomohiko Higa wrote: > I don't know much about Lieutenant Felina Feral, except that she's a > "good shot" (Mutation City). I have the impression that she's supposed > to be one of the best Enforcers, the Commander's objections > notwithstanding. > > Discuss. Aye, aye..Commander. (Who's also working on his sarcasm). I've only seen one ep with Selina - "Razor's Edge", and she seemed like an attempt to come up with a strong female role able to get her hands dirty, unlike Callie who's usually (though not always) indirectly involved with the action. I've only seen just the one instance, but in that ep she seemed a bit, well, "cardboard"...but that'll probably change when I see more of her (...appearances, I mean.). > third post to the list, but my first constructive one (it's about time! > I'm such an obnoxious brat) Heh! If that were illegal, most of us would be in MegaKat city prison right next to Hard-Drive. (joke, guys...and girls?) Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 09:21:47 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA24508 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:21:46 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 06:27:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Ann Gora, with MegaKat City News... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Okay, so she's the better date...I have the better wire service. "Hudson Soft" reports that the SNES game of SwatKats will be out in June. The syndication package of SK eps for 1995 evidently includes all the second season eps, so we should get to see all of them on TBS and affiliates before T.T. does anything stupid. I really have to call TBS and ask them when they plan to drop it off the air - I'd earlier heard "July", but that makes no sense if the toys are coming out in August ('course, it made no sense to cancel the show either...) I caught "Cry Turmoil" and "SwatKats Unplugged" (scrambled, of course) and got some nifty information regarding both eps off the phone. "Cry Turmoil" was initially supposed to be a focus ep for the character of Cmdr. Feral, who was slated for the slot T-Bone occupied in the version that made it to television. The plot was supposed to be much similar, but Lance Falk (the writer of the ep) wanted to have a discouraged Feral actually considering joining Turmoil because his hatred of the SwatKats was supposedly stronger than his loyalty to MegaKat City. Razor and T-Bone were to vanquish Turmoil approaching the ep's conclusion, and catch Feral in a compromising position, at which point he would have stated Turmoil's capture was "his plan all along". This follows Lance's theme of "character development", as he felt Feral could be less than an upright/uptight defender of truth and justice if the circumstances were right. An executive at H-B shot down the original script, explaining that the "show was about the KAT-guys, and no one was interested in the other characters" (or similar). Lance re-wrote it, and it appeared as we (some of us, anyway) saw it. Lance wasn't extremely pleased when he saw the final product. "SwatKats Unplugged" had an interesting bit of trivia as well. After bringing down a villain in the earlier part of the short, Ann Gora talks to T-Bone and Razor shortly after landing. T-Bone's statement sounded like it was fresh out of a bad 1940's "private eye" flick: "we have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly - we wanna be the good guys..." Actually, it was out of the '40's, it's a paraphrase of an evidently famous line from a Raymond Chandler private eye novel...Lance threw it in for yuks. Can you say "crossover audience", Ted T.?) Last, got the scoop on the good "Doctor" from an earlier post. Lance told pretty much the identical story, so you can bet the Tremblay brothers will remember. I've received permission to relay it to them, I'll print the response if they agree. (disclaimer: most of above relayed by another, I've not spoken to Lance personally) Andy _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it said,really..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 09:51:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA24640 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:51:49 -0400 From: Doctor Enigma Message-Id: <199504181355.JAA11078@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:55:32 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "Jonathan Tomohiko Higa" at Apr 17, 95 07:11:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1712 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > On Tue, 18 Apr 1995, Doctor Enigma wrote: > > Actually, one of the first comments I made after seeing SWAT Kats was that > > it's a very male show. Lots of hard hitting action, loudness, and machismo. > > Anyone agree? > > Whether I agree will depend on whether the definition of "male" is > "containing lots of hard-hitting action, loudness, and machismo." Last > time I checked, women were permitted into the military and perform the > same great service to our country in active combat as perform men. > > Ah, I know. I must be misinterpreting the post. In the SWAT Kats world, > he means that only males are permitted to be public defenders. Oh, no, > wait, that's not right--Felina Feral's there. Hm. I guess I'm just an > idiot; I can't figure out what he really meant. You are. First of all, I suppose I should have included a smiley, though I was only half-kidding. Second, I didn't say anything about women and action being incompatible. Kats' female characters are among my favourite in action cartoons. What I am saying is that there are certain traits relating to ego, macho, and testosterone-induced head-butting that are generally considered male. Not that females don't have the same traits, just that they tend to be expressed differently. I find that SWAT Kats leans heavily towards the "male" expression of those traits. -- ===================================================================== Emru Townsend, aka: emru@cam.org, / Editor of fps: the Magazine of switch@bix.com, Fido: 1:167/133 / Animation on Film and Video "That was a hoot!" / http://www.cam.org/~pawn/fps.html ===================================================================== From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 09:53:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA24654 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:53:43 -0400 From: Doctor Enigma Message-Id: <199504181357.JAA11133@Ocean.CAM.ORG> Subject: Re: Felina To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:57:26 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <9504180650.AA29754@cisk> from "Dana Uehara" at Apr 17, 95 11:50:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1301 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Jonathan Higa writes: > > I don't know much about Lieutenant Felina Feral, except that she's a > > "good shot" (Mutation City). I have the impression that she's supposed > > to be one of the best Enforcers, the Commander's objections > > notwithstanding. > > Actually, even the Commander respects his niece, and it's not just > because she's his niece (tho that is part of it). He once said, "I > oughta throw that niece of mine off the force, except my brother would > never speak to me again... and she's too good an Enforcer!" > > I remember some discussion coming up on rec.arts.animation about how > someone thought that Felina was "too PC for me"... and I'm still wondering > how Felina is PC (politically correct, for those of you who don't like > acronyms). Easy (he said, starting to veer off the subject): some people figure that if any show is putting a womanor minority in a position of power, it *must* be due to PC influences. -- ===================================================================== Emru Townsend, aka: emru@cam.org, / Editor of fps: the Magazine of switch@bix.com, Fido: 1:167/133 / Animation on Film and Video "That was a hoot!" / http://www.cam.org/~pawn/fps.html ===================================================================== From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 09:55:29 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA24676 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 09:55:28 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 07:01:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Fanfic: "SwatKats Unmasked?" To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: (This is written as though it takes place between eps, rather than an episode in its own right. I've used Lt. Steel from the first season because I was interested in his backstory, and wanted to extend his character/situation as set up in "Wrath of Dark Kat", which this would take place shortly after. There is likely going to be four parts, of which this is the first. If you're not a big fanfiction addict - e-me and I'll try drop you out of the loop.) __________________________________________________________________________ The sounds of hammering, drilling and welding emanated from the hangar beneath the garage. T-Bone turned up the televison to drown it out. As much as he liked leading the life of a "hero", T-Bone had always felt that a SwatKat needed his down-time, and on this particular evening "down-time" took the form of a "Scaredy Kat" marathon on MBS, a bag or three of nachos, and both feet on the coffee table. T-Bone turned the TV up another notch, in a vain attempt to keep pace with Razor's hammering in the hangar below. Six hours of "Scaredy Kat" had passed in no time, and Razor's "never-miss" program was up next in the form of "David Litterbin". "RAZOR! LITTERBIN'S ON....YOU COMIN?" shouted T-Bone, attempting to outdo both the television and the noise of Razor's tools. "RAZOR?..." T-Bone walked over to the ladder that descended into the hangar and leaned down, cupping his hands in front of his face in a futile effort to be heard over the din below. "RAZOR...YOU'RE GONNA MISS THE MONOLOGUE!" He climbed down the ladder into the hangar, and soon had to put his fingers in his ears to block out the noise of the welder. Underneath the TurboKat, a pair of feet and a shower of sparks was all that could be seen of Razor. T-Bone walked over to the power receptacle and yanked out the welder's power cord, unable to stand the noise any further. "Aww...CRUD, must've blown a fuse" came a voice muffled by layers of protective apparatus from beneath the TurboKat. T-Bone grabbed Razor's feet, pulling him and the mechanic's dolly he was on clear of the TurboKat's fuselage. "Hey Chance! What's the big idea? I was in the middle of...." "You know what they say buddy..." started T-Bone, dangling the end of the welder's cord in front of Razor's nose, "...all work and no play makes Razor a dull cat. Litterbin's on." Razor removed his mask and goggles, stepping back to admire his afternoon's work. The TurboKat looked no different to T-Bone, certainly not different enough to account for an entire afternoon better spent watching "Scaredy Kat" and wolfing nachos. "Watcha been doin' for six hours - the TurboKat looks exactly the same as always..." Razor was both proud and disgusted at the same time, though he realized that what he'd been working on wouldn't be evident to someone casually examining the jet's exterior. "I modified the engines; we should get 30 percent more thrust for the same burn ratio. I'm also working on a wireless throttle control system for the TurboKat's engines, so the next time we get shot full of holes by the likes of Dark Crud we won't have to worry about cut wiring..." "Razor...you know how I feel about unnecessary mods, there wasn't anything wrong with the engines just the way they were. Just like my old man used to say, 'If it ain't broke...." "...'don't fix it', yeah, yeah." Razor produced a small box with a single red button in the middle, took a last look around the hangar and pressed it. The engines on the TurboKat roared to life, producing a tornado of dust and debris throughout the hangar. The plane lurched and swayed against its restraints, then fell silent as Razor pressed the button yet again. Razor looked at T-Bone with the ear-to-ear grin of a kid with a good report card. T-Bone gave a cautious "thumbs up", then took the control box away from Razor and expertly tossed it into the TurboKat's cockpit - putting both hands on Razor's shoulders and marching him towards the ladder. "C'mon buddy, you can finish up tomorrow - maybe if we're lucky Litterbin will drop Feral from the ten-storey building tonight.." Though the two had markedly different personalities, they complemented each other like left and right halves of the same whole; much like a pair of shoes - each different in some respects, yet an obvious pair nevertheless. "David Litterbin" had not yet started, for the face of Ann Gora filled the screen covering preparations for the MegaKat City "Founder's Day" celebrations which would begin the following morning. "...in addition to the events from last year, there will be a free circus performance, including the largest collection of jungle animals MegaKat City has ever seen. The event will take place in the City Square, immediately after the opening address by Mayor Manx...", screamed the television, still at the audio level T-Bone had left it. "Yeah," said Razor,"..if anyone's still awake." T-Bone grabbed the remote, and lowered the audio to a reasonable level, reflecting on how choked the narrow streets of the downtown core would be with festival-goers. Mayor Manx attracted crowds like fur attracted fleas, and neither he nor Razor enjoyed the claustrophobic atmoshpere of such events. "Let's avoid it, shall we?", said T-Bone, with Razor nodding acknowledgement through a mouthful of nachos. "Callie says that Steel is going to be doing crowd control, Feral's out of town", mumbled Razor, chip fragments flying towards the TV. "That outta be good...Steel couldn't organize night after day. What's left to do on the TurboKat?" Razor thought for a moment, swallowed the remaining chips, and suddenly remembered that the cable for the grappling hook was looking a little the worse for wear. "Um...better get me up early buddy, I should do something with that cable before we need to use it again, it's in rough shape." They never got to see whether or not Litterbin did indeed drop Feral from the ten-storey building, both fell asleep where they sat. END OF PART ONE. _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it said,really..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 11:04:11 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA24978 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 11:04:11 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f93d57674c3002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 95 10:06:30 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... Content-Length: 2413 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >On Tue, 18 Apr 1995, Doctor Enigma wrote: >Emru Townsend wrote: >> Actually, one of the first comments I made after seeing SWAT Kats was that >> it's a very male show. Lots of hard hitting action, loudness, and machismo. >> Anyone agree? >Whether I agree will depend on whether the definition of "male" is >"containing lots of hard-hitting action, loudness, and machismo." Last >time I checked, women were permitted into the military and perform the >same great service to our country in active combat as perform men. News to me. I thought Congress had rejected attemps to allow women into active combat. Regardless, I have to agree with Emru, though I would call SWAT KATS a "boy" show instead of a "male" show. I dislike shows produced and marketed for gender-specific audiences (get ready for SAILOR MOON--the people behind this show have said they are going to market it as a "girl" show, because "boy" shows like VR TROOPERS failed to take off last season) and, unfortunately, SWAT KATS pretty much is geared toward a 6- to 10-year-old male audience. This doesn't mean girls don't watch it (a friend of mine once told me that her favorite show when she was a kid as JOHNNY QUEST), but they're not the show's primary viewers. >Ah, I know. I must be misinterpreting the post. In the SWAT Kats world, >he means that only males are permitted to be public defenders. Oh, no, >wait, that's not right--Felina Feral's there. Hm. I guess I'm just an >idiot; I can't figure out what he really meant. The Felina Feral character was pretty obviously added as an afterthought for the second season. And even though I like the character, she pretty much falls into one of the two stereotype female characters in "action" shows: The Helpless Damsel or the Tough Gal. Felina is the latter, while Callie is the former (though she acts like a Tough Gal, she's usually has to be rescued by T-Bone and Razor). This is not a major complaint about SWAT KATS. I don't expect a lot of deep characterization in a show like this-- just lots of nifty hardware and keen explosions. :) However, it would have been even nicer if the writers had tried to get out of the standard boy-show box they were into. -Tim ---- Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" -Percival McLeach From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 18 12:42:04 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA25431 for kats-ll; Tue, 18 Apr 1995 12:42:03 -0400 From: "Mitch Botwin" Message-Id: <9504181243.ZM25340@tekdev-10> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 12:43:29 -0400 In-Reply-To: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu "Re: Edgy Razors..." (Apr 18, 10:06am) References: <2f93d57674c3002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Apr 18, 10:06am, fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... > The Felina Feral character was pretty obviously added as an afterthought for > the second season. And even though I like the character, she pretty much > falls into one of the two stereotype female characters in "action" shows: > The Helpless Damsel or the Tough Gal. Felina is the latter, while Callie > is the former (though she acts like a Tough Gal, she's usually has to be If they had chosen the enforcer path for Callie, she would probably be there fighing the bad guys. She has saved Manx's fur enough times. She is definatly not a damsel in distress, but a damsel who uses the available resources to solve a problem. > rescued by T-Bone and Razor). This is not a major complaint about SWAT > KATS. I don't expect a lot of deep characterization in a show like this-- > just lots of nifty hardware and keen explosions. :) However, it would have > been even nicer if the writers had tried to get out of the standard boy-show > box they were into. > > -Tim > ---- > Reply to: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu > > -- http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/m279/fayxx001 -- > > "My mental facilities are TWICE what yours are -- you pea brain!" > -Percival McLeach > >-- End of excerpt from fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu -- Mitch Botwin ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Email: mbotwin@fir.fbc.com Tel:212-909-3118 uucp:HA!HA!HA! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- May you live in interesting times! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 19 02:47:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA04797 for kats-ll; Wed, 19 Apr 1995 02:46:55 -0400 Date: Tue, 18 Apr 1995 23:53:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Fanfic: "SwatKats Unmasked?" Pt. 2 To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: Here's part II, feel free to say "uncle" if you're getting annoyed. _________________________________________________________________________ "BRRRRRR......BRRRRRR......BRRRRRRRR....." Noise and red flashing light filled the darkened garage as Callie Briggs had something on her hands that only the SWATKATS could handle. The "hot-line" which set off the klaxon and the strobe-light was never intended as a wakeup call, but was effective nonetheless. T-Bone stirred first, grabbing the nearest handy object and flinging it toward his alarm clock, in the mistaken belief that it was the source of the disturbance. Razor fell off the couch as a direct result of T-Bone's sudden movement, landing on the half-empty dish of nachos in the process. "Huh...wha? T-Bone! Wake up! Callie's callin' " Razor had always given T-Bone every opportunity to answer the phone first, as he tended to be more insecure talking to women than the outwardly self-assured T-Bone, but this time he'd be the first one to the call box, and no getting out of it. "What can we do for you Miss Briggs?", Razor asked in a confident voice that surprised even himself. "Razor, the circus animals are stampeding downtown - the crowd's in a panic, and the Enforcers are just making things worse!" Callie's voice, though out of breath, still managed to convey the fact she was indeed the best looking politician MegaKat City had to offer. "We'll be there as fast as we can, Miss Briggs...not to worry!" "Up and at 'em Chance - Callie needs us!" Razor shook T-Bone awake, who'd been dreaming of frayed cables, ten-storey buildings, "Scaredy Kat" and nachos - and was barely able to understand the concept of morning without breakfast, let alone rampaging circus animals. Fireman style, they dropped down the ladder into the hangar, cleared away the mechanic's debris, and flew off into the morning sky high above MegaKat City. The scene at the City Square was far worse than even Razor imagined. Somehow, the tigers, lions, bears and elephants of the circus had broken loose and were chasing the throngs of terrified onlookers through the narrow streets of MegaKat City's business district. The Enforcers had blocked off all of the side streets leading onto the main strip in preparation for the parade, leaving the terrified crowd no means of escape save the open end of Main Street. Razor turned on the VHF radio and keyed in the channel of Enforcer Operations. The panicky voices of the Enforcers told Razor and T-Bone all they needed to know, the situation had gotten out of hand, and people were going to get hurt. The voice of Lt. Steel, distorted by the sounds of the commotion taking place below and the radio link, filled the cockpit. "This is Steel. We have to stop this from spreading any further through the city - block off the street now!" The Enforcer channel was silent for a couple of seconds, then the replies from various crowd control officers began. "Lt. Steel...we can't follow your orders sir, you'll be blocking off the only means the crowd has to escape - and I won't have that on MY conscience..." All the officers under Steel's command voiced similar objections, and T-Bone was the first to notice that Steel's car was now changing postion. "Aww, CRUD! Steel's blocking the street with Feral's car himself!" "Looks like Steel had an extra helping of Stupid with breakfast this morning..." added Razor, who was watching the events on the street via the Weapons panel. T-Bone could barely hear Razor above the sound of his stomach growling, and muttered only half audibly; "...at least he GOT breakfast this morning..." Callie Briggs was watching the whole spectacle from her vantage point atop City Hall, and also had noticed that a tragedy was about to take place. The position of Steel's car would leave people nowhere to run, and they'd soon be trampled under by the herd. She was close enough to the action to see Lt. Steel walk some distance toward the approaching crowd, bullhorn in hand. "This is Lieutenant Steel. Do not panic. The Enforcers have everything under control." It was apparent that Callie and Lt. Steel had a much different definition of "control", as the mob of citizens and circus animals was approaching Steel and his bullhorn with frightening speed. Callie heard the TurboKat a full minute before she caught a glimpse of it, and rummaged around in her purse for the radio the SwatKats had given her. She had a plan. T-Bone and Razor were circling the scene just below them, attempting to come up with a plan of attack. Missiles couldn't be used effectively in such a situation without injuring the people they were designed to protect. T-Bone banked the TurboKat to afford a better look just as the klaxon in the cockpit sounded. "Yes Miss Briggs?" answered Razor, achieving a new personal best of twice in the same day. "Guys...", began Callie, more composed than before, "...I've got an idea how we can regain some control here - without anyone getting hurt..." Callie relayed her idea, the first part of which involved removing Feral's car from the position Steel had left it, blocking the only means of escape for the crowd. Steel had by now realized his error, coming face to face with a large circus lion which regarded anything in uniform as "lunch". All pretensions of control long since abandoned, Steel dropped his bullhorn and ran faster than he'd thought possible - eventually finding refuge on the second flight of a fire escape, a perfect spot from which to watch the disaster he'd created unfold before him. T-Bone brought the TurboKat into a steep climb as Razor readied the grappling hook, a nagging feeling that he'd forgotten something dogging him through the checklist. T-Bone flew the TurboKat in low along Main Street above the heads of the mob, changing to Vertical operation directly above Feral's car as Razor lowered the grappling hook. The car was picked up easily by the TurboKat, just as the crowd reached the intersection. "Bingo!" The fleeing citizenry was now well clear of the animals, allowing the Enforcer units, under the command of Callie Briggs, to control the herd with gas grenades and cannon-launched nets. The street had soon returned to normal, save for an odd looking menagerie of disoriented animals being marched by the Enforcers back towards captivity. "Razor, now that we have Feral's car, whaddya want to do with it - turn it into a planter?" "Um...tempting T-Bone, but just fly us over to Enforcer headquarters and we'll set it down in the parking lot - we don't want to get stuck with another bill..." "Razor, anyone ever tell you you're no fun anymore..." T-Bone caught a glimpse of Steel, still perched atop the fire escape, and decided that a kind of aviator's "up-yours" was in order. Flying close enough to see the expression of pure hatred on his face, T-Bone moved the stick back and forth in the traditional "wing waggle" of fighter pilots, with Feral's car swinging to and fro beneath the TurboKat like some kind of giant yo-yo. Below his seat, Razor heard a noise like a rubber band snapping. He tilted his head to one side, perking up the closest ear in an attempt to discover the source of the noise above the roar of the TurboKat's thrusters. The second sound was louder, like a guitar string breaking - and he suddenly realized he'd forgotten something... "Aw, T-Bone...you really shouldn't outta have done that..." The cable holding the car parted with an almighty "SNAP!", dropping the vehicle and the remains of the frayed cable some 300 feet to the street below - directly in front of Lt. Steel, who was now shaking his fist and shouting something unintelligible above the noise of the TurboKat. The car landed roof first, smashing completely flat, leaving only the tires mute testimony as to what the crumpled mass of metal had originally been. T-Bone circled the TurboKat over the wreckage, determined to admire his handiwork, then broke out in a silly grin as he reached for the microphone to the TurboKat's Public Address system. T-Bone's sense of humour often ran towards the darkly sarcastic, and no opportunity was to be missed. His voice soon boomed throughout the block: "Look on the bright side Steel, at least you didn't get a parking ticket!" As T-Bone's laughter drowned out even the TurboKat, Razor put his head in his hands, closed his eyes, and wondered just how funny this would be when Feral got wind of it. They headed for the salvage yard, leaving Lt. Steel planning revenge, and a good excuse to give Commander Feral. ________________________________End of Part II____________________________ _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it said,really..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 19 14:19:18 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id OAA08032 for kats-ll; Wed, 19 Apr 1995 14:18:58 -0400 Message-Id: <9504191821.AA25043@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Apr 1995 11:22:49 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: GIF of Doc Konway content-length: 627 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I'll be sending a GIF of Doctor Konway (model sheet from the episode "Mutation City") to the list shortly. It's a large file, roughly 576K UUencoded, but I'll be splitting up the file into segments when I send it through. Standard copyright restrictions apply -- in other words, do NOT post this to the net (violation of this rule may lead to being dropped from the list without warning). Please let me know if you have any problems once the file is sent through. Thanks. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "T-Bone... if you drown, I'm gonna kill you!" -- Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 20 09:45:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA11804 for kats-ll; Thu, 20 Apr 1995 09:44:26 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 1995 06:47:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "SwatKats Unmasked?" Pt. III To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: I just watched all that crap on TV regarding the terrorist bombing. If that's how human beings treat each other, I'd sooner be a 'KAT. I just hope the law-enforcement equivalents of Razor and T-Bone catch up with the scum responsible before the Mayor Manx's start waffling about diplomatic sensitivities and such. For this, someone pays big. _________________________________________________________________________ Feral had always loved just two things in his life, his job, and his car. He was the fifth generation of Feral to hold the highest Enforcer post in the city, and had gotten there through a combination of discipline, integrity and courage - three things sadly lacking in the person of Lt. Steel, now cowering before him. "Steel, what happened to my car..." While Steel fought for the words, Feral recalled that the car had been the first one ever issued to him as Commander-in-Chief of the Enforcers. He kept the vehicle long after it was supposed to be turned in, and modified it as needed to keep pace with the technological advances standard on the newer machines. He would've even taken it with him while he was out of town, if it weren't for the need to drive the vehicle he was demonstrating to the press. He'd miss that car. "Steel...what happened to my car?" He'd been met at the outskirts of town by Mayor Manx and Callie Briggs, who'd informed him as to the circumstances regarding the vehicle's loss, and Steel's astonishing incompetence during the stampede. He now wanted to hear the explanation from Steel himself. Feral appreciated honesty, and was prepared to help Steel deal with his errors, providing he admitted them. "Steel...I'm waiting..." Feral's habit of drumming his fingers on the desk didn't help Steel's thought process any, and his answer reflected his growing anxiety. "Um, well...you see sir, it was all the SWATKATS fault - they um... deliberately dropped your car, sir - and they, er...something has to be done about those vigilantes, sir!" Steel felt that the best defense was a good offense, but Feral wasn't having any of it. Steel nevertheless seized the opportunity, and continued the attack. "I've come up with a plan, sir!.." his voice becoming squeaky, "...you see, we attach a homing transmitter to their plane sir, and we track them back to wherev...." "THAT'S ENOUGH, STEEL! Mister, you're incompetence nearly cost the lives of the very same citizens you swore to protect, the SWATKATS are the least of your worries. Maybe a little refresher course at Enforcer Academy will give you a better perspective; two weeks - without pay." Steel had never openly acknowledged making a mistake to anyone, he wasn't about to now. "But sir, what about my plan? We could get the SWATKATS out of the picture for good..." "Lieutenant - you, and your plan, had better be out of my office by the count of three. If you so much as mention it in my presence again, you'll be reading Parking Meters for the rest of your career.. now get...OUT!" Feral couldn't help but wonder what would've happened had the TurboKat not shown up when it did. Undisciplined vigilantes had no place among the ranks of the Enforcers, but Feral was beginning to realize that they did indeed have a place somewhere in the scheme of things. _________________________________________________________________________ "Hey Razor..." began T-Bone, still giggling from the episode with Feral's car, "...didja see the look on Steel's face when the cable snapped?!" "Yeah. I saw it alright, and you can bet that Feral will be wearing a similar one when he finds out who dropped it." "Aw, Razor - ya gotta learn to lighten up a little - it was an accident! A hilarious accident...but it's not like we planned it that way, though I doubt we could have done any better if we had...you need a hand?" T-Bone's "wing-waggle" not only percipitated the loss of Feral's car, but also managed to jam the remains of the cable in the door of the weapons bay, which Razor was now struggling to free. Though Razor was perfectly able of solving most problems dumped in his lap, T-Bone had the strength advantage and managed to free the cable with a single effortless tug. Razor had never been jealous of T-Bone in this regard, their partnership had always taken into account the strengths and weaknesses of each. Their only bouts of rivalry occurred in the company of Callie Briggs, though even this never amounted to more than good-natured ribbing. "Thanks T-Bone. You gonna hang around and help me fix the damage, or go further ruin your mind with 'Scaredy Kat' ?" T-Bone tossed the rag he was using square onto the bridge of Razor's nose, and beamed at the accuracy of his aim. "Looks like you're not the only sure-shot, Sure-Shot! Lemme grab a couple cans of milk first..." Given the choice between an evening with "Scaredy" and an evening with Razor, T-Bone would always pick Razor - if for no other reason than Jake was usually more laughs, and had less repeats. "While you're up there, see if we made the news - just don't trash the TV again if you see Feral; you break 'em faster than Katsui can make 'em..." Razor often wondered where they'd have been now had they not ended up together at the Salvage Yard after being drummed out of the Enforcers by Feral. He could've gone on to do countless different things, but he couldn't imagine any other occupation where T-Bone would "fit". Jake appreciated Chance's sense of humour and loyalty, but knew full well that such attributes had little market value in the Corporate World. People like T-Bone always stuck out like a sore thumb, but Jake couldn't think of anyone he'd rather have watching his back, in or out of the TurboKat. T-Bone soon reappeared at the bottom of the ladder, signalling that the TV had indeed survived the newscast. He lobbed a can of milk toward Razor, who deftly opened it with a single claw movement. "What'd the news have to say?" asked Razor, between gulps of milk. "Aw, the usual stuff...they had a cool shot of Feral's car turning into a metal pancake..." Razor couldn't help but giggle, causing the mouthful of milk to run down the side of his face, giving him the appearance of a half-drowned rat. He wiped the milk away with his arm, then shook his head to rid himself of the remainder. "No comment from Feral...that's odd." "Well, we still have a TV don't we? No, Feral was on alright, but even when Ann played back the footage with the TurboKat, all he could say was 'No Comment'...I thought Feral had a comment on everything!" "What about Steel? Hear anything out of him, or was he too busy trying to glue Feral's car back together..." It was T-Bone's turn to laugh, and he managed to spray Razor with milk from the astonishing distance of several feet. "Nah. Feral just said he'd been 'temporarily reassigned', probably means a trip back to the academy..." "Gee, I don't know who I feel more sorry for, Steel or the Academy... c'mon, lets get started. Once we replace the cable, we can get going on the wireless throttle upgrade and try it out in the Canyon tomorrow...I've hidden some new targets." "Right.." said T-Bone, "...as long as there's somethin' for me to do besides drive the bus, I hate sightseein'..." "Hah! The way you fly? You'll be lucky if you get through the run without parachute practice..." "Hey..." humphed T-Bone, in mock indignation, "...what's wrong with the way I fly?" "Dunno. Why don't you go ask Feral's car?" Razor quickly ducked the empty can of milk that came hurtling in his direction, which bounced harmlessly off the TurboKat and into the garbage can. T-Bone was indeed glad he'd elected to stay and help Razor, though he did manage to ensure "Scaredy" was a rerun while waiting for the news! _____________________________________________________________________________ Lt. Steel had many friends at the Enforcer Academy, in fact, he had many friends practically everywhere. What loyalty couldn't achieve, money could buy - and Lt. Steel's family had more than enough to go around. Steel had never actually had to work for anything, his rapid progress through the ranks of the Enforcers had far more to do with being the son of Manx's sister than it did with his own particular talent for law-enforcement. His friends at the Academy would help him carry out his plan to expose the SwatKats, and perhaps even get him Feral's job in the process. The plan was actually painfully simple, and Steel wondered why Feral hadn't thought of something similar much earlier. The SwatKats always used the same practice run on the outskirts of MegaKat City, and always practiced after carrying out any kind of repairs - such as would be necessary after the unfortunate incident in town. Steel had the "where" part of his plan, he even had the "how", now all he needed was the... "What?" "You heard me, I need a tracking device, and one that's powerful enough to let me track the SwatKats jet to wherever they hide it. I'm going to need some way of attaching it to the plane in flight, and it's going to have to stay put regardless of how fast they fly..." "Feral green-light this?", asked Dr. Alley, in charge of Academy Weapons R&D, "you're asking me to come up with some pretty expensive gear here..." "Ah, let's just say I'm 'exercising my initiative' and leave it at that.." said Steel, exposing a thick wad of money from his inside uniform pocket. "Fine by me, just so long as you're signing all the paperwork and paying the bills, you can 'exercise' all you want. What you need here is a version of what we use to track the movement of our own Enforcer jumpers, just far more powerful. The only drawback to such a device is that the increased output may disrupt any fly-by-wire and radio systems on the target vehicle, and..." Steel was hoping the good doctor would give him the short version... "...so they can't listen to their favourite station. My heart bleeds. Could we hurry this up..." Steel had little grasp of things electronic, as every modern convenience money could buy was still helplessly flashing "12:00" throughout his house. He was, however, a crack shot, and would have no trouble hitting the TurboKat with the delivery system Dr. Alley was in the midst of demonstrating. "Just follow the approach of the jet in the viewfinder, when the launcher gets the range information you'll see 'Lock' in the top left corner. Simply pull the trigger, and voila - the device will launch, attach itself to the plane, and self-activate shortly after impact." "Okay...then what?" asked Steel, who could already taste the cigars that came with Feral's office, "..what do I do after that?" Dr. Alley presented Steel with a device that resembled one of those cheap LCD kids games he'd always given nephews at Christmas - the only difference being that this device had compass directions labelled on it in place of the familiar poorly drawn cartoon characters. Dr. Alley activated the tracking device, and the screen in Steel's hands came to life, showing a blip near the cross-hairs in the center. He explained that as Steel approached the source of the blip, it would move closer to the center - enabling him to trace the whereabouts of the SwatKats, or at least their jet. Steel's plan was beginning to take form, as he practised looking through the launcher in the midst of the Weapons lab. Dr. Alley would be well rewarded for his efforts, just as the SwatKats would also get exactly what they deserved. Tomorrow would be a big day. ________________________________________________________________________ END OF PART THREE. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 20 19:39:31 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA13721 for kats-ll; Thu, 20 Apr 1995 19:39:27 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Edgy Razors... In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 18 Apr 1995 12:43:29 EDT. <9504181243.ZM25340@tekdev-10> Date: Thu, 20 Apr 1995 19:42:15 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr20.194225edt.46638@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Mitch Botwin: > If they had chosen the enforcer path for Callie, she would probably > be there fighing the bad guys. She has saved Manx's fur enough > times. She is definatly not a damsel in distress, but a damsel who > uses the available resources to solve a problem. yap. Callie's another stereotype, the supercompetent woman who outperforms the men she has to work with. April O'Neil tends to fit this as well. (if you find the right words, you can call anything a stereotype :) Manx makes a better damsel-in-distress than Callie, and I was getting pretty annoyed at his comic incompetence. I'm glad this was toned down in the second season. mmm. I just wish shows like this wouldn't stay focused on the main characters all the time. -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 20 21:06:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA13902 for kats-ll; Thu, 20 Apr 1995 21:06:55 -0400 Date: Thu, 20 Apr 1995 18:10:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr20.194225edt.46638@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 20 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > Manx makes a better damsel-in-distress than Callie, and I was getting > pretty annoyed at his comic incompetence. I'm glad this was toned > down in the second season. > > mmm. I just wish shows like this wouldn't stay focused on the main > characters all the time. > -- There's a reason for this "staying focused on the main characters", and it's got more to do with marketing than anything else. Like I said with "Cry Turmoil", it was initially supposed to be Feral in the T-Bone role, but H-B execs forced Lance Falk to re-write it. Some of the writers wanted to expand the other characters beyond set dressing, but were held back because no one had realized at the time that there was considerable "crossover" audience for the show. I found Manx hilarious personally, I don't know that he was "stupid", more like a representation of a politician whose first job once they get into office is to do as little as possible until they're re-elected. These people exist. I have only seen mostly the first season eps, but I was interested in Feral and Steel, here were characters that really needed their backstory told - Lance saw Feral as "able to be a bad guy given the right circumstances" - I chose a different route, I saw him as a type that almost worshipped the law - and allowed no flexibility in following the spirit of it, and the idea that the worst rules to break were the ones not written anywhere. Callie, not sure about her. I don't find her overly interesting so far, she doesn't seem to have any character quirks that bear exploration further. I'm sure the urge must've been there for the writers to have her "develop" some kind of relationship with either of the guys, but I've seen that done elsewhere in ac/adv - it's always a bad idea. Another thing to note, most series take a good 13 to 20 eps to catch their stride, probably part of the reason everyone raves about the second season eps as opposed to the first. 'KATS only made it to 23 eps, so I think the best was yet to come, from the story ideas I'd heard from writers. Andy (p.s. - I have access to the titles and ep descriptions for the three that weren't completed, I may have the actual scripts available as well. I just have to worry about the lawyer types before I can share too much of them once the mail shows up.) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 00:45:00 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA20974 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 00:44:44 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 1995 21:48:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "SwatKats Unmasked?" Part IV of V To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: Last part will be Sunday, if nothing stops me filling in the outline later tomorrow. News, first. I've been trying to get some questions answered at Hanna-Barbera, but I keep playing telephone tag with Victoria McCollum - three answering machine exchanges in both directions last count. I'll post the answers if I can. _________________________________________________________________________ T-Bone awoke to the sound of the alarm clock, which showed the battle scars of many a previous encounter with a solid object. Though a pilot first and foremost, his aim was something to fear, and the alarm clock was immediately silenced by an empty milk glass. The intermittent scream of the TurboKat in the hangar signalled that Razor was already up and preparing for the morning test-run in the Canyon. T-Bone grabbed a handful of stale nachos, two cans of milk, and headed for the ladder. Razor was a perfectionist, and had been up before even the birds to ensure that nothing unexpected would occur during the work-up run. The new wireless throttle control performed flawlessly, though T-Bone would take awhile to get used to the new calibration. The engines registered an output some 36 percent above average, translating into a groundspeed increase of nearly 120 mph - better than his highest hopes. He didn't notice the approach of T-Bone, as he leaned into the cockpit to tighten the last remaining screws. "BOO!" Razor banged his head on the canopy and dropped the screwdriver, turning to face T-Bone from the ladder. "Thanks a lump...you just used up about three of my lives!" Razor rubbed the back of his head, and reached out to accept the can of milk offered by T-Bone. "Sorry pal, I just couldn't resist. Why didn't you get me up?" "Well, I know how you feel about 'unnecessary modifications'... I just wanted to make sure we weren't going to have any problems before you got a chance to say 'I told ya so'. The new stuff's pretty cool... you get to go even faster!" Razor knew the weakness of all fighter pilots; the only thing better than "fast" was "faster". Going 36 percent faster would certainly take T-Bone's mind off of any concerns regarding "unnecessary modifications". T-Bone gave the jet a brief examination, checking the control surfaces and the engine intakes, slamming his empty milk can onto the wing as though it were a show of approval. "Great! What are we waitin' for?" "We were waiting for someone to get up...let's grab our stuff." T-Bone finished off his mouthfull of nachos, "faster" would certainly be a substitute for breakfast today, besides - there was always lunch. They rode the platform up to the runway level, discarding their coveralls in favour of flightsuits on the way. "Okay buddy..." began Razor, jettisoning the last of his tool belt as he climbed into the second seat, "...keep it slow for the first few clicks..." "Naturally, Sleeping Beauty - you can't see how well your stuff works if you're unconscious..." "Hah, hah, very funny...just don't do any high-g climbs until you get used to the new throttle ratio.." Razor had a fairly low tolerance for g-forces, which had caused him considerable ridicule during flight training at Enforcer Academy. He'd been mercilessly picked on by his fellow trainees, emerging from the centrifuge sessions unconscious more often than not. Nobody had wanted a partner that was liable to pass out in a heavy-g situation, and he'd been ready to call it quits until T-Bone - the most promising pilot candidate - requested him specifically as his Weapons Officer. Razor had never forgotten that, and wasn't about to get the opportunity; T-Bone called him "Sleeping Beauty" at least once a week! T-Bone didn't do any high speed climbing, but pushed the throttle to its limits anyway - easily outpacing the MegaKat Shuttle on its approach to the airport. T-Bone gave the "wing-waggle" salute, which was given in turn by the commercial flight. Everyone loved the SwatKats. ___________________________________________________________________________ Lt. Steel did not love the SwatKats, nor did he love getting up at 4 a.m. to get to the Canyon without being observed from the air. The "Canyon" was once a training are for pilots during MegaWar II, and was renamed "Manx Canyon" shortly after the war's end. Most locals still referred to it simply as "The Canyon", and the training area had lain in disuse for over 20 years. At the end of the site was an airstrip left over from the war, and it was here that Steel was heading to lie in wait for the SwatKats. The road leading to the strip was a "road" in name only, and the Enforcer cruiser was taking quite a beating, as was Lt. Steel trying to navigate the machine without the benefit of headlights. Steel turned the car through the remains of the gate, and headed towards what was left of the Hangar, choking through a thick cloud of dust. He drove inside, and once satisfied the vehicle couldn't be seen from the air, looked around for a building of suitable height - eventually settling on the shell of the Control Tower, some distance across the tarmac. Steel ignored the barely-legible "Keep Out" sign, pushed aside the remnants of the door, and climbed the steel staircase to the platform above. The rusting hulk of the Radar antenna served as a windbreak, and Steel propped himself against it's base, scanning the canyon walls for the likely approach route of the TurboKat. Dawn broke, the dust devils subsided, and Steel waited for his target. _________________________________________________________________________ "Gotta hand it to ya, Razor - the TurboKat purrs like a kitten.." "See...hate to say 'I told ya so' but..." Razor was thrown into his seat as T-Bone yanked back the stick, cued the afterburners, and pushed the throttle to its stop. The resulting sonic boom panicked the herd of cattle below, sending them scattering in every direction. "Sorry Razor, were you sayin' somethin' ? "I get the message...Head's up! Approaching first target..." The "missile lock" warning flashed on the display in both positions. T-Bone banked sharply left in an attempt to break the missile lock, but to no avail. Razor brought up the missile inventory on the Weapons display, and made his choice. The "missile proximity" alarm sounded just as Razor announced: "Slicer Missile - deployed!" The Slicer made contact with the control fins of the approaching missile, sending it spinning out of control into the canyon wall - resulting in a spectacular explosion. "BINGO!!!" "Um...Razor? Please tell me that was the only explosive one..." "Hey, you said you didn't want to 'sightsee'...next one's all yours buddy!" Razor folded his arms across his chest, making it clear that T-Bone would have to deal with the next encounter unassisted. The "missile lock" alarm sounded a full second before T-Bone caught the telltale flash of a missile launching from the canyon wall. He headed directly for a natural land bridge spanning the canyon, and didn't appear to be altering course quickly enough to suit Razor, who's worried expression he caught in the mirror. "Ah, T-Bone..." Razor was quite obviously distraught, but was determined not to give T-Bone the satisfaction, and kept his arms folded. The "missile proximity" alarm made a curious note coupled with that of the "Terrain Collision" warning, and the land-bridge filled the view ahead. Razor closed his eyes, the signal T-Bone had been waiting for, and the pitch of the TurboKat's engines changed to a scream as he pulled back the stick and maxed the throttle, causing the TurboKat to climb out of harm's way, and the missile to slam into the land bridge. Razor's arms were still crossed, and his eyes tightly shut...causing T-Bone no end of amusement. "Whatsamatter buddy? No appreciation for the majestic beauty of land formations?" "No...more like no appreciation for 'scratch and sniff' terrain encounters...I thought I said to hold off on the high-g stuff.." Razor checked the status panel, which showed the wireless throttle link to be performing perfectly. "Razor, you worry too much...you said yourself that you'd checked everything thoroughly - c'mon, lets have some fun!" T-Bone brought the jet low into the canyon itself, weaving in and out of the natural obstacles completely by instinct, until the canyon widened out on the approaches to the old airstrip. The "missile lock" warning sounded yet again. _________________________________________________________________________ Steel had dozed off, and was awakened by the sound of the land-bridge exploding and crashing into the canyon below. He could hear the TurboKat approaching, and scanned the horizon through the launcher's viewfinder - eventually catching sight of the TurboKat as it cleared the narrow part of the canyon. "Lock" appeared in the top-left corner just as Dr. Alley said it would, and Steel pulled the trigger as the TurboKat drew even with him in a steep bank preparing for another run at the canyon. He followed the track of the projectile through the viewer, watching it impact on the underside of the aircraft just in front of the landing gear as the TurboKat disappeared back up the canyon. He dropped the launcher and rummaged around in his knapsack for the tracking device, wondering how long "shortly after impact" actually meant. He turned on the tracker, and waited for the appearance of the blip. Everything was set, he'd promised certain officers a promotion for helping him bring the SwatKats to justice, even managing to convince them it was Feral's idea. Once the blip stopped moving, he'd track it to its source, call in the troops, and arrest the SwatKats just in time for the six o'clock news. Feral wasn't scheduled back from his press event for hours, and once he found out about it - it'd be too late - and everyone in MegaKat City would know that _Commander_ Steel had succeeded where Feral had always failed. _________________________________________________________________________ "..'Missile Lock'? I didn't put anything this far out...must be some kind of glitch." Razor tapped the "Lock" indicator, hoping the lamp would extinguish. "Negative buddy, it's on my panel too..." Both heads frantically scanned the sky as the "Missile Proximity" alarm screamed that impact was imminent. T-Bone did all the SAM avoidance manuevers he knew how, but nothing was showing up on the Weapons panel, and no missile could be seen. The proximity alarm went to a fever pitch. "T-BONE!...WE GOTTA PUNCH OUT!!!!!" Both their hands went automatically to the "eject" levers as T-Bone prepared to blow the canopy, then...nothing. The cockpit fell silent. "Wha...what happened?!" "You're complaining?!! Razor, you must've messed somethin' up when you were playin' with the throttle controls...we almost ditched for nothin' !" "I..I don't get it. Those two systems don't talk...it's impossible.." Razor checked the status panel, which showed nothing but green lights, and no indication of a missile event. "Yeah, well...'impossible' or not, I'm not flying a plane I don't trust, and right now I don't trust the TurboKat...we're headin' home..." T-Bone had a clear mental picture of his father saying the familiar "if it ain't broke, don't fix it", as he set course for the Salvage Yard, watching the reflection of Razor in the mirror still frantically trying to determine the cause of the malfunction. T-Bone pushed the throttles up just as Steel's transmitter device actuated, causing the interference Dr. Alley had predicted. The cockpit alarm sounded. "THROTTLE LINK FAIL?!!!...aw, CRUD!!!" T-Bone fought with the throttle control, as the TurboKat's engines alternately surged and slowed. The airspeed was dropping, and he knew he'd have to gain as much altitude as possible before the engines quit completely - it would be the only chance for any kind of controlled landing. "Razor...anything else you'd like to 'improve'...before we CRASH!!" "..it doesn't make any sense, it all checked out...I don't understand..." "Understand later. We're going to lose the hydraulics when the engines quit, I'm going to have to land it in the Salvage Yard rather than attempt the hangar. I want you to punch out just before we get there..." "NEGATIVE, T-Bone! We BOTH ride it in, or we BOTH bail out...besides, you'll need my help with the chutes." Neither of them had attempted a dead-stick landing in the TurboKat, but T-Bone would need both hands for the stick, and he knew it. He switched the wing setting to the subsonic mode, and made the last turn before final approach. Steel's device had managed to knock out every instrument landing system on the jet, and the engines had finally quit altogether. It would be a bumpy ride. "Fine. Have it your way, Razor. Get your harness as tight as you can stand it, dump your missiles, and gimme the checklist.." The TurboKat descended evenly, the Salvage Yard and Garage looming ever larger through the perspex of the windshield. Razor began the checklist. "Fuel Shutoff?" "CHECK..." "Weapons Systems Off-Line?" "CHECK..." "Gear Down and Locked?" "CHECK..." T-Bone knew he'd have to touch down in the uneven area just short of the Salvage Yard, they had only the drag-chutes to slow them down and needed all the runway they could get. The TurboKat would have to end up as close to the Garage as he could judge it, they had to get it out of sight as quickly as possible after landing. T-Bone tightened his harness until he had trouble breathing, as Razor got to the final item on the list. "Jettison canopy...NOW!" Wind and dust whipped through the cockpit as T-Bone fought to see through the windshield, it took every ounce of strength just to hold the jet steady without the help of the hydraulics. "RAZOR...COUNT DOWN WITH ME...FIVE...FOUR..." T-Bone screamed at the top of his lungs, Razor counting in unison. "...THREE...TWO..." The ground rushed up and the TurboKat hit heavy. Razor waited for all wheels to touch and deployed the drag-chutes. The Garage was coming up fast, and the chutes appeared to be doing little to slow their approach. The TurboKat shook violently as it encountered potholes and debris on the makeshift runway, and T-Bone waited until the last possible second for the surface to improve before jamming the brake lever full on. Tires screaming in protest, the front landing gear collapsed - plowing the nose hard into the dust and dirt of the yard. T-Bone's harness ripped away from its mount and threw him into the console, cracking his helmet with the force of the impact. The TurboKat had landed. _________________________________________________________________________ END OF PT. IV From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 01:06:28 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA21089 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 01:06:28 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504220509.AA43463@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: Bad SWAT Kats Technology? To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 00:09:01 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3430 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: A sure sign that a person loves a show is how they act like they hate it when they nipick it. (Just look at how Star Trek fans treat their shows.) There are three pieces of technology from SWAT Kats that I simply cannot accept. I'm not exactly certain which episodes each comes from, but I consider them all to be a tarnish on SWAT Kat's generally solidly established technolgy reputation. I tend to get really irritated when a solid technolgical basis for a show, toy line, or whatever is trashed. Back when I used to watch TMNT every day, I tried to keep a mental record of all of the technologies on the Party Wagon, Turtle Blimp, and other vehicles. But a tremendous amount of inconsistencies kept appearing, and I became flustered, had to throw up my hands and more or less say "It's not real, so who cares?". The same thing happened with Transformers. First Autobots can fly, then they can't. After awhile, the tech specs became outrageous (Flies a million times the speed of light! Can lift mountains with ease!), and often still are. Anyway, the first bad piece of technolgy I can think of is a blade shooting gun Razor used in Destructive Nature (I think). He comes up to a wall and needs to get through. Does he blast a hole with his Glovatrix? No, he pulls out an unusual looking gun and fires two sets of miniblades into the wall. Somehow these tiny blades land in a perfect circular pattern even though the gun doesn't fire them in such a manner, and the second set even lands exactly where the first didn't. Only after the blades have firmly sunk into the wall and remained motionless for a split second do they start spinning and moving in a circle to cut through. Let's face it folks, this is some really awful technology and poor thinking on the parts of the writers, artists, storyboarders, animators or whoever is responsible. Item number two. I believe at another point in Destructive Nature (Might not be, heck, probably isn't, that episode.), T-Bone needs to get around or through a fence. He cuts it with some miniblades that fly out of his Glovatrix. Not only would the miniblades need a tremendous amount of velocity to cut the fence, but they probably wouldn't have hit anyway (Try throwing a rock at a wire fence and see if you hit it.). Since clipping the fence with wire cutters may have taken longer and been kinda boring, he should have jumped it (If it was possible), "Tomhandled" it if you will, blasted it, or something else, just not shoot tiny blades at the thing, that's for sure. The third piece of bad technolgy that comes to mind is the "middle engine car" (Whatever it's called) from Bride of the Pastmaster. Suddenly the middle engine can come off and it's sprouted wheels, fins, and even a cockpit to boot?! Why not just use the double seated Cyclotron? I tried to rationalize the existence of the middle engine car, I really did. But I figured that it was way to complicated and requirering far too much removal of ductwork, inclusions of ridiculous add-ons, too much sacrificing of precious space, and other bits to make it feasible, especially when another more convienient alternative was available. I can't think of any others, so if you do, please add them, and then, maybe we can start up the converse of this list: The coolest technology from the show. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 02:08:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA21288 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 02:08:22 -0400 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 1995 23:12:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Bad SWAT Kats Technology? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504220509.AA43463@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I haven't seen the ep in question, but similar stuff in the eps I've seen kind of grated a bit when I saw how far the laws of physics were stretched, though I wasn't bothered to the extreme that Kevin was. I think the point is that the show could be made more along the lines of BTAS, where the weaponry is fairly realistic, and the show has a more "mature" feel. I'd love to see this type of thing applied to a KATS movie (should the Tremblays get the cash), but I'm not sure you could do it to the TV show now, without a negative impact on some of the younger viewers. Listen to some of the "I like it because..." comments that voice-over the credits at the end, a lot of them say things like "it's cool when they..." etc, these are the people that like the way out gadgetry, and are also the people such stuff is written in for. The only two things that bother me about 'KATS is the occasional lack of consideration for the "conservation of mass" rule, when a missile contains more hidden stuff than can be reasonably contained by its exterior casing, and when the TurboKat appears to have enough room for too much in the way of wheeled gear like the "SandKat". It's similar to how irritating it was when the Transformers weaponry doubled in size, simply because it was no longer attached as a functional part of their bodies. Funny, but the only bad comments I've ever heard concerning the show being "silly", have come in regards to two episodes - "The Wrath of Dark Kat", and "The Giant Bacteria" - all because in both instances the 'KAT guys used missiles that opened up and sawed their way into solid objects. I personally think even the five-year olds laughed at that one, but I still liked both those eps. Face it, "cartoon physics" is a contradiction in terms, but like Kevin, I like the show enough to be able to criticize it on occasion. Andy (second season stuff dumped some of the sillier gadgets, no?) _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it said,really..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 02:30:29 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA21342 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 02:30:28 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504220633.AA55753@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: Re: Bad SWAT Kats Technology? To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 01:33:15 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 21, 95 11:12:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2213 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Funny, but the only bad comments I've ever heard concerning the > show being "silly", have come in regards to two episodes - "The Wrath of > Dark Kat", and "The Giant Bacteria" - all because in both instances the > 'KAT guys used missiles that opened up and sawed their way into solid > objects. I personally think even the five-year olds laughed at that one, > but I still liked both those eps. Face it, "cartoon physics" is a > contradiction in terms, but like Kevin, I like the show enough to be able to > criticize it on occasion. > > Andy (second season stuff dumped some of the sillier gadgets, no?) > > > _________________________________________________________________________ > "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... > ....it said,really..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX > _________________________________________________________________________ > > Andy, you must be on the net the same time I am: Friday Nite/Saturday Morning cuz your responce was within minutes of my mailing. Anyhow, I forgot all about the "technolgy" you just mentioned. I guess both of those missles, the Cockpit Cutter and that missles that carved through solid rock with those tiny blades would count as "bad". But you want to hear something really anal? SWAT Kats isn't a cartoon! Think about it. The primary purpose of the show is not to make you laugh, but to thrill you, and under those criteria, it is not a cartoon. But I guess it does tend to be rather pointless what you call it as long as you enjoy the show. But back to the technology bit. I figure that really little kids will gawk and smile at just about anything, but to be on the safe side, all the technolgy on the show should be of the cool, mecha sort found in anime so older folks like us won't be burying our faces in our palms and blushing at the TV when we see something out and out stupid (and it *is* a good thing the second dumped the silly stuff.) Oh, and don't you hate it when grappling hooks would wrap around a pole without even touching it as they did numerous time on TMNT and Batman: TAS. I sure do! Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 06:50:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id GAA21888 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 06:50:52 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. In-reply-to: Your message of Thu, 20 Apr 1995 21:10:28 EDT. Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 06:53:48 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr22.065402edt.45470@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill: > There's a reason for this "staying focused on the main characters", > and it's got more to do with marketing than anything else. yep, and I don't quite understand it. there's always the villains, and there are plenty of them. there's no marketing drive to stay focused on one particular villain, is there? > I found Manx hilarious personally, I don't know that he was > "stupid", more like a representation of a politician whose first job > once they get into office is to do as little as possible until > they're re-elected. These people exist. oh, it would have been fine in an occasional joke, but as a recurring character, Manx's incompetence gets pretty annoying. he's not a freshman politician. he keeps getting reelected, so he must be good at something. shrug. so Callie does all the real work, and Manx is just a figurehead. why doesn't Callie run for mayor? > Callie, not sure about her. I don't find her > overly interesting so far, she doesn't seem to have any character quirks > that bear exploration further. why does she put up with Manx? does she have a family? is she married to her job? why isn't there more conflict between her and Feral? > I'm sure the urge must've been there for > the writers to have her "develop" some kind of relationship with either > of the guys, eesh. I hope not. it unbalances everything. > but I've seen that done elsewhere in ac/adv - it's always a > bad idea. I wonder why. it should be possible to do it well. mmm. maybe it's too hard to avoid damsel-in-distress syndrome? -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 12:09:25 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA22558 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 12:09:24 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 09:14:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Bad SWAT Kats Technology? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504220633.AA55753@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 22 Apr 1995, Kevin L. Knoles wrote: > Andy, you must be on the net the same time I am: Friday Nite/Saturday > Morning cuz your responce was within minutes of my mailing. Actually, I was on for hours yesterday, banging in the story manually because my site won't let me upload files (yet). > Anyhow, I forgot all about the "technolgy" you just mentioned. I guess > both of those missles, the Cockpit Cutter and that missles that carved through I played this bit back and forth, and I think the weaps panel says "Cookie Cutter" > something really anal? SWAT Kats isn't a cartoon! Think about it. The > primary purpose of the show is not to make you laugh, but to thrill you, and > under those criteria, it is not a cartoon. But I guess it does tend to be The dividing line between "cartoon" and "animated series" begins to blur a little when you view the last few years. Avery's statement "the only...cartoons are funny ones..." kind of died with the forties. > when we see something out and out stupid (and it *is* a good thing the second > dumped the silly stuff.) I don't speak "marketing" very well, it's too much at odds with why I like the characters and the show. SWATKATS is aimed at the 6-11 audience demographic, and to be perfectly honest, no one was shocked more than H-B to discover they had a considerable crossover viewership (15 through adult). I'm guessing here, but I would guess that's why Mook was renewed as the animation "co-producer", rather than the Hanho split reflected in the first season. The Tremblays contributed a lot of story material to the second season as well, and I think they convinced the Turner people that the mean age of the audience was somewhat higher than what they'd initially figured - which explains some of the more mature themes in the second season stuff. As far as anime-type gadgetry and weapons, hmm. "Robotech" (not off-top, Dana :>) when it was on was a great show with quality animation, but it didn't grab the 6-11's enough to suit the toy/marketing people. This concerned Turner, who made sure that the writers stuck to writing for the 6-11 age group. Anime stuff also tends to be very realistic, and that isn't acceptable any more in the era of so many broadcast restrictions in the kids market - another reason for some of the more outrageous gadgetry - it's designed to capture the foe rather than destroying him. Anyway, the whole target market/timeslot thing is about to land in a tar pit, producers of animation are realizing that stuff like SWATKATS appeals to a huge audience outside the 6-11's, and even if the show gets pulled off the air, lessons learned the hard way by people like Turner will pave the way for other shows like it. It's just too bad the 'KAT guys have to pay the bill. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 12:35:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA22639 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 12:35:43 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 09:40:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr22.065402edt.45470@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 22 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > yep, and I don't quite understand it. there's always the villains, > and there are plenty of them. there's no marketing drive to stay > focused on one particular villain, is there? ...aah, don't know about this. Marketeers planning the toy lines generally (Disney) try to steer the shows course along the lines of confrontations with the villains that are likely to appear in Toys R Us. SWATKATS liked DarkKat a lot (one of the toys!), as well as the PastMaster and Dr. Viper (another of the toys). With villains, you have strike a balance between having them captured and escaping once each week, as opposed to other shows with a "mad scientist of the week" type of scenario. SWATKATS, in my opinion, has done a fine job of keeping the scales balanced in this regard, and I haven't so far heard any comments like "they use...(so-and-so) too much". > why does she put up with Manx? does she have a family? is she > married to her job? why isn't there more conflict between her and > Feral? This kind of thing is what gives SWATKATS "somewhere to go" outside of the traditional ac/adv formula. The characters are outlined well, but they aren't cardboard cutouts, and there is lots of potential for stories that develop the incidental characters - especially in the situation you mentioned. How about a story where Feral does something unconscionable to the KAT guys, and she initiates a move to dump him in favour of some up-and-comer, who may not be what he/she appears? > > I'm sure the urge must've been there for > > the writers to have her "develop" some kind of relationship with either > > of the guys, > > eesh. I hope not. it unbalances everything. This is something I think is very important. I can only speak for myself, but one of the reasons I like the 'KAT guys so much is that they're not obsessed with skirt-chasing. Face it, some of us don't value the white-picket fence, two-car garage version of life - and not all of us are pursuing the girls or our dreams as the first step on the way there. I personally value the kind of relationship the 'KAT guys have with each other far and above the kind of two-dimensional liasons that would occur if they pursued the Callie/romantic thread. "Turmoil" was about as far as they should go down that road, IMO. There's too much of this romance/jealousy/sex-as-a-weapon stuff in the Prime Time world, it doesn't need to infect the last remaining watchable TV, like SWATKATS, some other cartoons, and a lot of the Trek Stuff. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 19:25:30 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA23838 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 19:25:28 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 22 Apr 1995 12:40:35 EDT. Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 19:28:49 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr22.192850edt.45515@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > ...aah, don't know about this. Marketeers planning the toy lines > generally (Disney) try to steer the shows course along the lines of > confrontations with the villains that are likely to appear in Toys R Us. hmm. I guess I've been assuming that it's easy enough to create and sell arbitrary action figures. but besides the development costs, it's probably hard to pitch, say, a Callie figure at the 6-11 market. (is there an April O'Neil figure? I can't remember seeing one advertised. time to go digging in a toy store. just for research, of course :) > How about a story where Feral does something unconscionable > to the KAT guys, and she initiates a move to dump him in favour of some > up-and-comer, who may not be what he/she appears? ok. but how about getting rid of the "not what they appear" gimmick? hmm. Felina is a natural choice for a replacement for Feral, which introduces all sorts of interesting story possibilities. dunno how well it could be done in the limitations of the TV series though. might make interesting fanfic. > I personally value the kind of relationship the 'KAT guys have > with each other far and above the kind of two-dimensional liasons that > would occur if they pursued the Callie/romantic thread. heh. since when are romantic relationships two-dimensional? shrug. they're hard to handle in boy-oriented action/adventure stories. funny that recurring characters in cartoons are rarely married. oh, they have all types of stable relationships, but they're rarely involved in stable romance. I've got dozens of silly theories for why this is true, and I don't even know if it _is_ true. :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 21:15:33 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA24267 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 21:15:31 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 18:20:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr22.192850edt.45515@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 22 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > > up-and-comer, who may not be what he/she appears? > > ok. but how about getting rid of the "not what they appear" gimmick? I wasn't referring to someone in disguise or anything, just perhaps an up and coming Enforcer with a hidden agenda. > heh. since when are romantic relationships two-dimensional? > > shrug. they're hard to handle in boy-oriented action/adventure > stories. funny that recurring characters in cartoons are rarely > married. oh, they have all types of stable relationships, but they're > rarely involved in stable romance. I've got dozens of silly theories > for why this is true, and I don't even know if it _is_ true. :) Every time, without exception, that I've seen this attempted, the romance just kind of lays there, like "Phantasm". In the kind of fighter-pilot cameraderie that's central to T-Bone and Razor's relationship, there isn't room for a third entity without adversely affecting their situation. I don't know about anyone else, but when most of my high school friends got romantically entangled and married off, that was essentially it. Their whole outlook on life, the universe and everything became confined to their rec rooms and backyards. Reference the introduction of a romantic interest for Raphael in the TMNTA comix - big mistake. It breaks up the situations already in place, and drags the nature of the stories and the characters off-course. It may eventually have a place in ac/adv stuff, but I don't think its here. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 22:25:01 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA24517 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 22:25:00 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 22:28:30 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 22 Apr 1995, Andy Hill wrote: > > On Sat, 22 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > > > > up-and-comer, who may not be what he/she appears? > > > > ok. but how about getting rid of the "not what they appear" gimmick? > > I wasn't referring to someone in disguise or anything, just perhaps > an up and coming Enforcer with a hidden agenda. > > > heh. since when are romantic relationships two-dimensional? > > > > shrug. they're hard to handle in boy-oriented action/adventure > > stories. funny that recurring characters in cartoons are rarely > > married. oh, they have all types of stable relationships, but they're > > rarely involved in stable romance. I've got dozens of silly theories > > for why this is true, and I don't even know if it _is_ true. :) > > Every time, without exception, that I've seen this attempted, the > romance just kind of lays there, like "Phantasm". In the kind of > fighter-pilot cameraderie that's central to T-Bone and Razor's > relationship, there isn't room for a third entity without adversely > affecting their situation. I don't know about anyone else, but when most > of my high school friends got romantically entangled and married off, > that was essentially it. Their whole outlook on life, the universe and > everything became confined to their rec rooms and backyards. Reference > the introduction of a romantic interest for Raphael in the TMNTA comix - > big mistake. It breaks up the situations already in place, and drags the > nature of the stories and the characters off-course. It may eventually > have a place in ac/adv stuff, but I don't think its here. > > Andy > Could you explain why you Hate the Relationship of Raphel and Ninjara? I think it adds to the story line something more than just them beating up the bad guys all the time. Ninjara is a female character who finds love behind Raph's hard exterior. and that shows that the turtles are not just going around fight evil every time. It shows that can also have real feelings. Matmilam From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 22 22:33:30 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA24569 for kats-ll; Sat, 22 Apr 1995 22:33:29 -0400 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 1995 19:38:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "SwatKats Unmasked?" Pt. V of V To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: Yeah, its early...but I was sitting on the beach in the sun and felt like writing. _________________________________________________________________________ The dust settled, and T-Bone extricated himself from his position both half on and half under the instrument panel. He wiped away the blood trickling into his eyes from the sizeable gash in his forehead, and sniffed the air for any trace of aviation fuel. He had a pounding headache, and the matted fur beneath his ears told him he'd received a concussion serious enough to warrant attention. After a few attempts, he managed to stand upright and turned to glare at Razor, who sat motionless in his seat, eyes fixed on the floor. Razor looked up to meet T-Bone's stare, but quickly turned away to escape the judgement it represented. T-Bone half-fell out of the cockpit, and surveyed the damage - realizing that the TurboKat had little chance of being moved to the hangar without hours of work. They'd certainly be discovered long before that, and he sat down on a pile of debris, fumbling with his helmet strap. Razor rid himself of the harness, climbed out of the cockpit, and sat down next to T-Bone, without even once looking up. T-Bone finally freed the strap and pulled off his helmet, widening the cut above his eye in the process. Razor was alarmed at the amount of blood, and reached out toward him. "Hey, that looks pretty bad - better let me have a look at it.." Razor tried moving the fur aside to expose the cut, but T-Bone stood up and knocked his arm away. "DON'T YOU THINK WE'VE SEEN ENOUGH OF WHAT YOUR 'HELP' CAN DO FOR ONE DAY! You should have left well-enough alone, but no, Razor has to screw around, nearly costing us the TurboKat, AND OUR LIVES IN THE PROCESS!!!" T-Bone threw his helmet against the steel of the garage door, and Razor stared at the ground, shuddering at the sound of the impact. "I'm sorry, T-Bone..." But he was talking to himself, and T-Bone walked into the garage, leaving Razor sitting there, kicking in the dust. _________________________________________________________________________ Feral had enough of the dog-and-pony show that passed for the unveiling of the latest Enforcer vehicle. He'd spent two days of the long weekend at the Proving Ground site, and had no wish to hang around for another one of Manx's interminable speeches. There was real Enforcer work to be done, and the TV crew would just have to find someone else to misquote that afternoon. He sneaked behind the caravan of Television trucks, and made it to the parking lot unobserved, started his car, and turned on the two-way to see if anything interesting was happening anywhere on such a day. He was just in time to here the voice of Lt. Steel ordering an Enforcer contingent to the MegaKat City Salvage Yard...to arrest the SwatKats. Feral stepped on the gas and ran through the checkpoint without stopping; Steel had overplayed his hand once too often. _________________________________________________________________________ Side by side, without speaking a word, Razor and T-Bone cleaned themselves up as much as possible, and changed into their coveralls - emerging from the garage just in time to see Lt. Steel leaning nonchalantly against his car, tracker in hand. Steel moved the device toward the TurboKat, and the beeping changed to a steady scream. "Hi...'SWATKATS'..." He nodded toward the Enforcers flanking him, who moved towards T-Bone and Razor, handcuffs ready. T-Bone backed away from the approching Enforcers, looking for a defensible position. "Hey Steel, your momma know you're out this late?" Two Enforcers jumped on him, driving his head into the dirt. Razor tripped the Enforcer attempting to handcuff him, and ran towards the others. "Hey creep, can't you see he's got a head injury..." Razor tackled T-Bone's assailant, but was himself thrown face-first into the ground, right next to T-Bone. Steel walked towards them. "Touching. Engaged, or just dating..." Razor looked up from beneath the knee of his captor. "Why, Steel....you jealous?" The remark earned Razor a knee in the shoulderblades, and an extra notch on the handcuffs. Steel headed toward the TurboKat. "Tsk, Tsk...you should really work on those landings, 'SwatRats' - no wonder you got thrown off the force..." T-Bone growled, his vision blurring with the blood streaming into his eyes. The Enforcers dragged them to their feet, and cuffed them to each other across the telephone pole in the yard. Steel walked back to his car, and leaned up against the fender. "You know, they're going to pin a medal on me for capturing you two, I might even get a parade in my honour..." T-Bone and Razor looked at each other, then despondently at the ground. "...I can see the headline now...'Steel Captures Vigilante Pilots', ...has a nice ring to it, don't you think? Search this dump..." He motioned to the nearest Enforcers, who started toward the garage. "...and after that, a promotion will be in order..." Steel gestured to an imaginary billboard in the sky, "...how does 'Commander' Steel sound?..." "....PREMATURE." No one had noticed Feral's arrival, and he now stood behind Steel, arms folded. "Mister...you've got a lot of explaining to do..." Steel was surprised at Feral's unscheduled appearance, but he held all the cards, and wasn't the least bit intimidated. "Explaining? To who...you? I've done in two days what you couldn't in two years..." he said, gesturing toward his prisoners, "..I've captured the famous 'SwatKats' !" Feral looked at Steel, then at the SwatKats - meeting T-Bone's gaze in a mutual display of unbridled hatred. Feral had a decision to make, and could feel that the eyes of every Enforcer were on him. There was much to consider, but certain rules couldn't be broken by anybody - even himself - and Steel had broken them all. "These..." Feral said, indicating T-Bone and Razor,"...are the SwatKats? Don't make me laugh. These two are nothing more than a pair of washed-up cowards; they didn't have what it takes to be Enforcers, and they certainly don't have what it takes to be anything more than they are - a couple of pathetic grease-monkeys..." T-Bone was shaking with rage, but was kicked by Razor before he could utter a single syllable. "But...what about all the evidence...?" Steel spread his arms in exasperation, indicating the TurboKat and its surroundings. "..what evidence? Look around you Steel...where's the runway, where's the hangar, where's any shred of evidence to link these two with the SwatKats?" Feral's speech had the desired effect, and the Enforcers around Steel looked around the yard, and began to wonder if they hadn't been a bit hasty to follow Steel this far. T-Bone and Razor stared at each other in complete bewilderment, Feral's behaviour was inexplicable. Steel picked up the tracker, and walked over to the TurboKat, the beep becoming a continuous screech. "We..we have the plane, sir...I tracked it all the way from the Canyon to..." Feral yanked the tracker from Steel's hand, and tossed it to the ground beside the TurboKat. "Mister...all you have is an overactive imagination, too much ambition, and a couple of third-rate mechanics caught red-handed stripping a junked jet in their own salvage yard...." Feral drew a circle in the air with his hand, and the Enforcers returned to their cars. Steel backed away until he bumped into his own car door. "..y..you're letting them go...you can't do that!" Feral reached past Steel through the open window of the Enforcer cruiser and pulled a metal booklet off the dashboard, slamming it against Steel's chest, and walking towards the shackled prisoners. "I..I don't understand sir," said Steel, looking at the metal booklet labelled 'Parking Tickets', "..what does this mean?" "You're a smart guy Steel, work it out." Feral threw the handcuff keys at the feet of Razor and T-Bone, then went back towards Steel, opening the car door for him. Steel threw the ticket book inside, slammed the door, and sped off in a cloud of dust. Feral and the SwatKats stared at each other through the dust cloud for what seemed minutes, then he returned to his car and drove off. Freed from the cuffs, T-Bone picked up a length of pipe and walked over to the tracking device, still screaming in the dirt where Feral had thrown it. He saw the transmitter under the wing almost immediately, and covered his eyes as he smashed the device out of existence, silencing the tracker. The effects of the concussion were beginning to take their toll, and T-Bone collapsed on the ground next to the plane, just managing to sit up. Razor threw the cuffs into the dumpster, dusted himself off, and sat down beside T-Bone. "Razor..I'm sorry for what I said, none of this had anything to do with you...what can I say?" Razor looked over the yard, then up at T-Bone who was too ashamed at his behaviour to take his eyes off the ground. "Well..." Razor paused, lifting up T-Bone's chin, "...you can say you'll let me have a look at that cut..." _________________________________________________________________________ Steel signed his mane, as he did almost a hundred times a day, and placed the ticket under the windshield wiper of MegaKat City's worst parking violator. He caught the reflection of the TurboKat in the windshield passing above him, as it did often during the course of his new job. He'd have another opportunity some day, even if he had to make it. THE END _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it's SAD (really)..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 23 18:18:24 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA02365 for kats-ll; Sun, 23 Apr 1995 18:18:02 -0400 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 1995 15:24:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: 3rd Season scripts... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Got some more cool info that some of you might like. There were a few script ideas that didn't get produced for various reasons, that were slated for the third season. Lance Falk wrote them, and here's a couple of the summaries. The first was going to be a sequel to "Chaos in Crystal", with the Rexx Shard character at a work detail somewhere, being exposed to something which enabled him to change into kind of a "black hole" entity, sucking every bit of heat from whatever he targeted. It was set to be called "Cold War", but evidently was shelved in favour of "Turmoil 2", one of the three extant scripts that would've made up episode 24. Falk created a script called "Blowout", which by his own admission was not too happy with, and Glenn Leopold eventually took it over and re-wrote it as "Katastrophe", which he agreed turned out better than his original idea could have. The third idea was "Blackout", which would have started with the 'KAT guys battling villains from the first episode in a holographic flight simulator - picture this scene with Mook's animation! "Blackout" was intended as a villain who caused cave-ins at strategic locations underneath MegaKat City's key power stations, sucking them into the ground. The villain character was supposed to be a nerdy-type police scientist who learned the tricks of the supervillain trade by watching old movie serials - and had access to massive underground base created by a previous supervillain who was no longer around (I can't say why, because Lance may use the "twist" involved in a current project unrelated to the KATS). Hanna-Barbera politics, Pt. II. Davis Doi was almost universally adored by the people who worked for him, however, another individual was universally detested by everyone - and seems to be responsible for a lot of the problems, and possibly had something to do with the cancellation. Lance forwarded a "SwatKats Merchandising Guide", which is what is presented to the manufacturers of the games, action figures etc to give them an idea of what could be produced. Seems that there was considerable interference from this individual concerning the merchandising, and Lance's ideas (he wrote a lot of the copy, and drew many of the concept pictures) ended up being far better than what eventually got green-lighted! His opinion of the gentleman in question was not phrased in printable words. I really like this guy. Anyway, I wouldn't mind posting some GIF's from the book, but I don't have access to a scanner at the moment, and I'm trying to figure out what kind of trouble I can get in if I don't have all the signatures required. Andy. _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it's SAD (really)..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 23 22:55:54 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA03698 for kats-ll; Sun, 23 Apr 1995 22:55:52 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 22 Apr 1995 21:20:47 EDT. Date: Sun, 23 Apr 1995 22:59:22 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr23.225931edt.45603@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill: > > > up-and-comer, who may not be what he/she appears? > > ok. but how about getting rid of the "not what they appear" gimmick? > I wasn't referring to someone in disguise or anything, just perhaps > an up and coming Enforcer with a hidden agenda. yah, that's what I meant. hidden agendas are easy and somewhat overused. what happens if you try to avoid that? in real life, everyone has personal agendas, and everyone knows that everyone has personal agendas. say that Felina replaces Feral. I can't see Felina willing to push aside her uncle, but she'll probably step in if the position's empty. so Feral has to become unavailable somehow. he could be killed or MIA, but it's more interesting if he stays nearby. say, he resigns, or maybe he's suspended due to criminal charges brought against him. the specific charges are a problem. if the Kats aren't ever charged for their antics, Feral can probably make the legitimate complaint that he's being treated unfairly. couple ways of dealing with this. anyway, the quick-and-easy way of getting "serious" drama is to say "okay, nobody is a villain" and see where that takes you. doesn't quite fit the SWAT Kats framework though. no big deal. > I don't know about anyone else, but when most of my high school > friends got romantically entangled and married off, that was > essentially it. Their whole outlook on life, the universe and > everything became confined to their rec rooms and backyards. heh. the nesting instinct. preparation for having children. it's not universal. but I can't think of any counterexamples offhand :) oh, how about Sonic the Hedgehog and Sally? not married, but likely to be. -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 00:09:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA04129 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 00:09:13 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504240412.AA21609@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: A Short Movie Scene To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Sun, 23 Apr 1995 23:12:29 -0500 (CDT) Cc: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3044 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Here's yet another brief scene I thought up for SWAT Kats: The Movie. While flying over MegaKat City after saving the day once again, our intrepid aviators prepare to head home. T-Bone: All set to go buddy? Razor: Uhh...not quite. I picking up some punk stealing a purse from an old lady. T-Bone: Let the cops handle it. Razor: But they all just got wiped out back there. T-Bone: What do ya want us to do about it? Razor: Well, I was thinking *we* could stop him. T-Bone: Let me get this straight, you want to stop a purse snatcher with a 40 ton jet?! That's crazy! We fight supervillians and monsters, not muggers. Razor: You're not just gonna let him get away with it, are you? T-Bone: No...I guess you're right. And with that T-Bone flies the Turbokat off to catch the punk. The purse snatcher is walking along going through the purse tossing out what he doesn't want: a comb, a pair of glasses, some medication, a spare set of dentures. Suddenly a giant shadow looms over him and there is a loud roar accompanied by a strong blast of warm air. The purse snatcher stops dead in his tracks and slowly looks up. His eyes widen, his jaw drops, and his ear starts nervously twitching at the sight of the massive and angry black silohette hanging overhead. A voice is heard over the loudspeaker. T-Bone: Uh...Give the lady back her purse. The purse snatcher just stares and the twitching continues. T-Bone: You heard me! Go pick up all her stuff and give it back to her. The Purse snatcher blinks two more times and then quickly scampers along picking up the discarded items as the shadow follows him. The old lady has managed catch up at this point and is now looking upward and smiling. The purse snatcher sheepishly hands her the purse and receives a wallop with it as soon as he does. There's a bit of laughter from the cockpit. The purse snatcher spies a nearby alley and is just starting to take off for it when T-Bone intervenes. T-Bone: Stop! The purse snatcher stops dead in his tracks, turns around and notices the Cement Machine Gun and an array of missles tracking his every motion. T-Bone: Just where do you think you're going? The cockpit opens and a pair of handcuffs is thrown out. T-Bone: Cuff yourself to that streetlight with these and wait for the cops. The purse snatcher does so and the Turbokat takes off. Razor: See, that went well. T-Bone: Well, you could have at least said something. Razor: What, and let not let you have all the fun? T-Bone: Yeah, Yeah... Let's just not do that often, OK? I *knew* you were planning something like this when I saw you pack those handcuffs. Razor: As soon as we got the opportunity, anyhow. But wouldn't ya say the look on that kat's face made it all worth it? T-Bone: Maybe. Let's head home. And the Turbokat soars off into the distance. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 00:51:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA04321 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 00:51:11 -0400 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 1995 21:57:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr23.225931edt.45603@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 23 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > say that Felina replaces Feral. I can't see Felina willing to push > aside her uncle, but she'll probably step in if the position's empty. > so Feral has to become unavailable somehow. he could be killed or > MIA, but it's more interesting if he stays nearby. say, he resigns, > or maybe he's suspended due to criminal charges brought against him. What I actually had specifically in mind here, is a writer's trick that's been used on TMNT, He-Man, and some others, but rarely well. Felina aside for the moment, say Feral is wrongly accused of something as suggested, and is suspended from the force pending an inquiry. The 'KAT guys are no doubt happy that Feral's history, but something worse takes his place, perhaps himself (or herself) being responsible for the incident Feral is being blamed for? Something occurs, and it becomes obvious to everyone that Feral is needed, and the SwatKats work alongside him to prove his innocence...I think it works. It's the old "pact with evil to accomplish good" bit - and can be used to develop all the characters a notch or two if handled properly. Lance Falk probably would've come up with something similar, it's right up his alley. > anyway, the quick-and-easy way of getting "serious" drama is to say > "okay, nobody is a villain" and see where that takes you. doesn't > quite fit the SWAT Kats framework though. no big deal. Yeah, problem here is, as they've no doubt noticed - how "good" the good guys are is often only a reflection of how "bad" the bad guys are. It's usually the result of weak writing, but the format of the 22 minute ac/adv show doesn't allow for too much background stuff for character motivations that aren't readily apparent - you kind of have to know who's who before the opening credits. "Cry Turmoil" was written as the first of two parts, the second one, "Turmoil 2" was to be episode 23. It would've been great, because all the hard character/situation setup stuff had been done in the first one, allowing some really good character interaction concerning the "shades of grey" involved in actual life, as opposed to the good/bad polarization of most of the stories. (gee, listen to me...do I even sound like I know what I'm saying?) > heh. the nesting instinct. preparation for having children. it's > not universal. but I can't think of any counterexamples offhand :) I don't really want to see a representation of average existence in entertainment, the nature of cartoons like the 'KATS is escapism, although themes that occur in life are explored. I just don't really want to see the view out of my own particular window duplicated verbatim on the screen! Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 01:01:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA04377 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 01:01:21 -0400 Date: Sun, 23 Apr 1995 22:07:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: A Short Movie Scene To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504240412.AA21609@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 23 Apr 1995, Kevin L. Knoles wrote: > Here's yet another brief scene I thought up for SWAT Kats: The Movie. ****Yet ANOTHER? If you had others I'd like to see them, this one's great! > Razor: Uhh...not quite. I picking up some punk stealing a purse from an > old lady. > And with that T-Bone flies the Turbokat off to catch the punk. The purse > snatcher is walking along going through the purse tossing out what he doesn't > want: a comb, a pair of glasses, some medication, a spare set of dentures. > Suddenly a giant shadow looms over him and there is a loud roar accompanied by > a strong blast of warm air. The purse snatcher stops dead in his tracks and > slowly looks up. His eyes widen, his jaw drops, and his ear starts > nervously twitching at the sight of the massive and angry black silohette > hanging overhead. A voice is heard over the loudspeaker. Outstanding visualization. Need some light source, not bright, like some kind of dim streetlight so that the crook can make out the silhouette and the Kat-guys (as well as the camera) can see the expression on the dude's face. > The Purse snatcher blinks two more times and then quickly scampers along > picking up the discarded items as the shadow follows him. The old lady has > managed catch up at this point and is now looking upward and smiling. The > purse snatcher sheepishly hands her the purse and receives a wallop with it > as soon as he does. There's a bit of laughter from the cockpit. The purse > snatcher spies a nearby alley and is just starting to take off for it when > T-Bone intervenes. I can picture the old lady they always have to help in their mechanic jobs. > Razor: As soon as we got the opportunity, anyhow. But wouldn't ya say > the look on that kat's face made it all worth it? That look does make it all worthwhile, I've nabbed a few creeps myself. Anyone actually read mine, or are we all playing "catchup" on 700 e-mail messages like me? Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 03:02:17 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA04746 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 03:02:15 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 03:06:00 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: 3rd Season scripts... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPPA3P8VUA8X1GLW@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: If you get all the signitures I do have a scanner wich I'll be glad to scan all the pics from that catalog. The only problem is you will have to give up the catalog for the time being so that I can scan them. Funny, Dana didn't tell you that I had a flatbed scanner available. Well, if you want those pics scanned after you get the needed signatures then let me know if you are intrested so I can leave you my snail mail address. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 03:20:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA04791 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 03:20:14 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 00:26:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: 3rd Season scripts... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPPA3P8VUA8X1GLW@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995 WKOZIOL@delphi.com wrote: > If you get all the signitures I do have a scanner wich I'll be glad to scan > all the pics from that catalog. The only problem is you will have to give up > the catalog for the time being so that I can scan them. Funny, Dana didn't > tell you that I had a flatbed scanner available. Well, if you want those > pics scanned after you get the needed signatures then let me know if you are > intrested so I can leave you my snail mail address. Done. I just have to work it out from my end. What we really need, fellow list dwellers, is a "home site" on a system somewhere that will give us the needed room, and won't be overly concerned with carrying GIFs and JPEGS. Any suggestions? Andy. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 05:08:49 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA05105 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 05:08:47 -0400 Message-Id: <9504240912.AA19079@cisk> Subject: Re: A Short Movie Scene To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Mon, 24 Apr 95 2:12:33 PDT In-Reply-To: <9504240412.AA21609@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> from "Kevin L. Knoles" at Apr 23, 95 11:12:29 pm From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 2162 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Kevin L. Knoles writes: > Here's yet another brief scene I thought up for SWAT Kats: The Movie. > > While flying over MegaKat City after saving the day once again, our > intrepid aviators prepare to head home. This sounds like a scene for the end of the movie, *but* it could also serve as a scene for the beginning. > T-Bone: Let the cops handle it. Change 'cops' to 'Enforcers' -- then you could add stuff like: Razor: But they all just got wiped out back there! T-Bone: With *Feral* leading them, whaddaya expect? Besides, pal, what could *we* do, anyway? Razor: Well, I was thinking *we* could stop him. And so on... On to other stuff: Given the high traffic on this list, I'll be starting an FAQ shortly. Let me know if you'd like to put anything on the FAQ and I'll do my best to accommodate you. Also, as far as my survey goes: because of limited time I haven't had a chance to post the results. I will do so as soon as I have the opportunity to do so. "The Deadly Pyramid" (an episode I didn't have on tape until this past showing) was on this past weekend. I've got a few comments on it (possible SPOILERS ahead): Animation by Mook. A lot of the stuff, especially the robot, looked very anime-ish (very nice, in other words). I heard from a couple of people that I was talking to at ConFurence 6 that Christian Tremblay had initially wanted Mook to do *all* of the animation for the episodes that aired. He got his wish for part of the first season and all of the second. The "Mountain Tours" bus: is it just me, or did all of the passengers on the bus, including the driver, get killed in that scene? When the bus is thrown over the cliff, you hear the passengers as it lands in the chasm. A few scenes later (in real-time, this would hardly be enough for everyone to escape, provided they survived the bus's plunge down the cliff), one of the mummies throws the bus at an Enforcer chopper, destroying the bus (and chopper) in a large fireball. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 09:48:38 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08569 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 09:48:36 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 06:55:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: A Short Movie Scene To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504240912.AA19079@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > This sounds like a scene for the end of the movie, *but* it could also > serve as a scene for the beginning. I figure "beginning" would be ideal, maybe after some sequence involving the Enforcers getting trashed by some moderately menacing monster, and the 'KATS dispatching it - in other words, the movie opens right in the middle of an action sequence, perhaps as the opening credits are rolling, then we get the scene Kevin wrote. It'd play really well, the movie would begin interesting, and we'd have the full spectrum of the 'KATS do-good nature exposed before the "meat" of the movie. > T-Bone: With *Feral* leading them, whaddaya expect? Besides, pal, what > could *we* do, anyway? > > Razor: Well, I was thinking *we* could stop him. I really liked this device, of Razor repeating a phrase used by T-Bone within his answer. T-Bone often phrases questions with a kind of "sarcastic" edge, and Razor kind of de-fuses them with these kinds of answers. > Let me know if you'd like to put anything on the FAQ and I'll do my > best to accommodate you. Hmm. I don't know that we've had any questions that frequently asked yet, but as the start of some kind of KATS archive, it's a great idea. Could start with the ep descriptions, where to find print articles relating to the KATS, upcoming toys 'n' such, details of the cancellation - how do you want to handle submissions? > "The Deadly Pyramid" (an episode I didn't have on tape until this past > showing) was on this past weekend. I've got a few comments > on it (possible SPOILERS ahead): > > > Animation by Mook. A lot of the stuff, especially the robot, looked > very anime-ish (very nice, in other words). I heard from a couple of people > that I was talking to at ConFurence 6 that Christian Tremblay had > initially wanted Mook to do *all* of the animation for the episodes that > aired. He got his wish for part of the first season and all of the > second. Yep, heard something similar. Mook was VERY expensive, but once anyone saw the comparison between Mook and Hanho, it was very hard to enjoy the Hanho ones as much as the first time around. I am not kidding when I say that, although I saw it scrambled, this was the best animation I've ever seen on television, ever...full stop...nothing beat it and likely never will. > The "Mountain Tours" bus: is it just me, or did all of the passengers > on the bus, including the driver, get killed in that scene? When the > bus is thrown over the cliff, you hear the passengers as it lands in > the chasm. A few scenes later (in real-time, this would hardly be > enough for everyone to escape, provided they survived the bus's plunge > down the cliff), one of the mummies throws the bus at an Enforcer > chopper, destroying the bus (and chopper) in a large fireball. Got two phone calls on this, and had a, well...strongly worded e-mail exchange. Those people didn't get out, and it was clearly intended that way. I personally don't worry too much about defining villains in terms that involve actual consequences, but this was quite contrary to what usually gets by Broadcast Standards and Practices. I'm going to call Christian on this one, I liked this ep immensely for the animation (did have a kind of anime feel to it, didn't it?), story was pretty good too, sure appreciate seeing characters as good as T-Bone and Razor given enough respect to warrant this quality of stuff. I suppose Turner begs to differ. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 11:57:37 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA13756 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 11:57:35 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 12:01:23 -0400 Message-Id: <199504241601.MAA29266@unix3.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "SwatKats Unmasked?" Pt. V of V Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: -> The "Mountain Tours" bus: is it just me, or did all of the passengers -> on the bus, including the driver, get killed in that scene? When the -> bus is thrown over the cliff, you hear the passengers as it lands in -> the chasm. A few scenes later (in real-time, this would hardly be -> enough for everyone to escape, provided they survived the bus's plunge -> down the cliff), one of the mummies throws the bus at an Enforcer -> chopper, destroying the bus (and chopper) in a large fireball. - - Got two phone calls on this, and had a, well...strongly worded -e-mail exchange. Those people didn't get out, and it was clearly -intended that way. I personally don't worry too much about defining -villains in terms that involve actual consequences, but this was quite --contrary to what usually gets by Broadcast Standards and Practices. I'm -going to call Christian on this one, I liked this ep immensely ...... Standards and Practices be buggered! When I wrote my fanmail, one of the things I mentioned was the fact that they did dare to depict characters dying. I have never been able to stand the "fortunately there were no injuries in the nuclear blast" mentality that tries to shelter children from all unpleasantness. In an age where lunatics can blow up crowded buildings in Midwest cities, I think that kids *need* to be exposed to death, lest they be completely unable to handle it when it comes to the real thing. I applauded the Tremblays for allowing Swat Kats to have a body count, for this very reason. If parents are worried about their poor little kiddies having nightmares if they see a busload of people get blasted on a cartoon, then they'd damn well better worry about what's going to happen when their little ones see the same thing happen on the news. Just the two cents of a man who used to watch the Coyote actually hit the ground, and still managed to lead a normal life when he grew up. :\ ---- Samuel Conway, Ph.D. Senior Evil Genius Avid Therapeautics, Inc. Philadelphia, PA flogistn@netaxs.com From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 14:51:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id OAA18909 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 14:51:31 -0400 Message-Id: <9504241855.AA23459@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 11:55:31 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... content-length: 3158 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I've received a couple of email messages expressing concern about ticking me off (or, in furry lingo, rubbing my fur the wrong way). My response is don't worry about it because I usually let people know almost immediately if they're doing something like that. This is especially easy to do in email. Also, as far as posting to the list versus private email: I don't worry about this either; the reason I ask for stuff (like survey responses) to be sent to me via email is because I don't want to flood anyone else's mailbox with stuff that I'm specifically asking for. Because the list server is automated and there's no moderation, anything you send to the list is immediately distributed to everyone on the list. And now, on to a few listmail replies: Andy: I figure "beginning" would be ideal, maybe after some sequence involving the Enforcers getting trashed by some moderately menacing monster, and the 'KATS dispatching it. Not to mention that this has been done in the series ("Bride of the Pastmaster" comes to mind, for example). - how do you want to handle submissions [for the FAQ]? OK, here's how I'll do it: I've already drafted up an FAQ file which explains the "reasoning" behind Turner's cancellation of the series and some of the rumors which have been floating around. I've also included Hanna-Barbera's address, for anyone who wants to write the studio (note: you probably also might want to write any local station you have that shows the series). If you want to add stuff to the FAQ (and I'll acknowledge everyone who submits stuff that I end up using), email me. (You can post to the list if you want, but you may risk the wrath of those who don't want FAQ material filling up their mailbox, particularly if it's repetitious. ;-) Doc "K"onway: When I wrote my fanmail, one of the things I mentioned was the fact that they did dare to depict characters dying. I have never been able to stand the "fortunately there were no injuries in the nuclear blast" mentality that tries to shelter children from all unpleasantness. Killing off characters, particularly one-shots, seems to be a new trend that's coming up in not only SK, but other cartoons as well ("Mighty Max" and "Exosquad", for example -- I've seen MM but not ES). But you've got more than a valid point: the news is very violent as it is, and sometimes I think TV news coverage seems to glorify this by doing special reports on violent acts (human or natural), such as the Oklahoma bombing, O.J. Simpson, the Kobe earthquake and so on. I was talking with someone once who said he couldn't believe that the SWAT Kats couldn't kill someone accidentally, especially if their misguided missiles hit buildings and such. While this may be true, they've never been *aware* of civilian casualties resulting from their missiles until the episode "Razor's Edge." Any comments on this? -- ================= Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================ "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 21:53:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA21157 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 21:53:03 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 95 15:56:57 HST Message-Id: <9504250156.AA00617@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >I was talking with someone once who said he couldn't believe that the SWAT >Kats couldn't kill someone accidentally, especially if their misguided >missiles hit buildings and such. While this may be true, they've never >been *aware* of civilian casualties resulting from their missiles until the >episode "Razor's Edge." Any comments on this? Given that Commander Feral would have legal cause of action against the SWAT Kats should they truly injure innocent citizens, I deduce that in fact they have not injured any innocent citizens, as far as the Enforcers know. Razor goes to great lengths to design the "disabling" missiles (as mentioned in earlier posts). It is imperative to the SWAT Kats' cause that their right to continue to serve and protect as private citizens is not suspended. I do not deny that they are still good guys (using the tacitly accepted definition of "good"). Rather, this perception of their cause also explains why they aren't simply avoiding blowing up things for the sake of Broadcast Standards and Practices. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 21:53:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA21171 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 21:53:49 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 19:00:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: The world ended? Was everyone okay? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504241601.MAA29266@unix3.netaxs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995 flogistn@netaxs.com wrote: > Standards and Practices be buggered! > > When I wrote my fanmail, one of the things I mentioned was the fact that > they did dare to depict characters dying. I have never been able to stand > the "fortunately there were no injuries in the nuclear blast" mentality that > tries to shelter children from all unpleasantness. In an age where lunatics > can blow up crowded buildings in Midwest cities, I think that kids *need* to > be exposed to death, lest they be completely unable to handle it when it comes > to the real thing. I applauded the Tremblays for allowing Swat Kats to have a > body count, for this very reason. If parents are worried about their poor > little kiddies having nightmares if they see a busload of people get blasted > on a cartoon, then they'd damn well better worry about what's going to happen > when their little ones see the same thing happen on the news. > > Just the two cents of a man who used to watch the Coyote actually hit the > ground, and still managed to lead a normal life when he grew up. :\ Thank you for this, I just finished typing something very similar to some cretin on rec.arts.animation who complained about "gratuitous"violence on the 'KATS. I pointed out that teaching our kids to grow up thinking everyone's going to be their friend, and that there will be a positive message at the end of everyday is unrealistic and irresponsible garbage. BS&P entities have got to be the most evil creations on the face of the earth, and the damage they do in their holier than thou quests is inestimable. There are other opinions on this issue, so hopefully no one considers the above as flamebait. Andy (Dr. Moreau nailed one of the things I caught on to very early, and is one of the reasons I like the 'KATS so much, it doesn't dodge issues of life and death, and manages to say CRUD without someone(s) plugging their ears in righteous indignation!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 22:12:39 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA21245 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 22:12:38 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 22:16:34 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: The world ended? Was everyone okay? To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995, Andy Hill wrote: > > > On Mon, 24 Apr 1995 flogistn@netaxs.com wrote: > > > Standards and Practices be buggered! > > > > When I wrote my fanmail, one of the things I mentioned was the fact that > > they did dare to depict characters dying. I have never been able to stand > > the "fortunately there were no injuries in the nuclear blast" mentality that > > tries to shelter children from all unpleasantness. In an age where lunatics > > can blow up crowded buildings in Midwest cities, I think that kids *need* to > > be exposed to death, lest they be completely unable to handle it when it comes > > to the real thing. I applauded the Tremblays for allowing Swat Kats to have a > > body count, for this very reason. If parents are worried about their poor > > little kiddies having nightmares if they see a busload of people get blasted > > on a cartoon, then they'd damn well better worry about what's going to happen > > when their little ones see the same thing happen on the news. > > > > Just the two cents of a man who used to watch the Coyote actually hit the > > ground, and still managed to lead a normal life when he grew up. :\ > > Thank you for this, I just finished typing something very similar to > some cretin on rec.arts.animation who complained about > "gratuitous"violence on the 'KATS. I pointed out that teaching our kids > to grow up thinking everyone's going to be their friend, and that there > will be a positive message at the end of everyday is unrealistic and > irresponsible garbage. BS&P entities have got to be the most evil > creations on the face of the earth, and the damage they do in their > holier than thou quests is inestimable. There are other opinions on this > issue, so hopefully no one considers the above as flamebait. > > Andy (Dr. Moreau nailed one of the things I caught on to very early, and is > one of the reasons I like the 'KATS so much, it doesn't dodge > issues of life and death, and manages to say CRUD without someone(s) > plugging their ears in righteous indignation!) > Can i say something? I watch this show because i know life is cruel....and to a certain extent the Swat Kats can die at any time....the question is when. The thing that makes this better than most cartoons is the fact that the hero'd themsleves are weakened by there own egos and demons.. also there not really good guys. there men who belive in kicking but rather than discussion. (I will never act like that in life). Swat Kats is a show that came out the "Johnny Quest snydorme" the age when Johnny Quest dominated the air waves with his non-superhero like ablites. That was gone until Swat Kats came back with the same idea. But because Mr. Ted Turner can't get away from cookie cutter shows (Mainly Captain Planet) this show will never come back. Matmilam P.s. i guess the kids at school were right....Swat Kats can be beatten even by the X-Men. (Swat Kats 1993-1994, you kicked tail, to no avail) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 22:36:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA21355 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 22:36:22 -0400 From: MATT_W@delphi.com Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 22:40:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPQF6P2E2Q99EX4M@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Monday, April 24, Andy Hill wrote: >incident Feral is being blamed for? Something occurs, and it becomes >obvious to everyone that Feral is needed, and the SwatKats work alongside >him to prove his innocence...I think it works. It's the old "pact with >evil to accomplish good" bit - and can be used to develop all the >characters a notch or two if handled properly. Lance Falk probably Hmm.. Sounds quite a bit similar to "The Wrath of Dark Kat" (I think). Feral & SWAT Kats working together to stop DK from dropping the bomb. Feral was an "outsider" due to Steele's over-confidence in trying to secure Feral's job. And it did work! I always liked the stories where Feral, TBone & Razor "get along" more than the usual attitude taken by Feral (...vigilantes...blah, blah). But I digress... > I don't really want to see a representation of average >existence in entertainment, the nature of cartoons like the 'KATS >is escapism, although themes that occur in life are explored. I >just don't really want to see the view out of my own particular >window duplicated verbatim on the screen! I agree completely with you on this one! :-) Actually, the interaction between the main characters on a personal basis provides for some very entertaining moments. Each time the writers give us a little glimpse into the "every-day" life of TBone & Razor, the characters become _more_ believable and not just a "robot" who goes out & does a job 1, 2, 3... It adds a "three-dimensional" aspect to the character & personality of each of them. I would actually prefer to see more of this in each episode! But given the 22 min. barrier, I'm sure it's really difficult for the writers. -Matt From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Mon Apr 24 23:00:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA21406 for kats-ll; Mon, 24 Apr 1995 23:00:14 -0400 Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 20:07:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPQF6P2E2Q99EX4M@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995 MATT_W@delphi.com wrote: > But I digress... > > > I don't really want to see a representation of average > >existence in entertainment, the nature of cartoons like the 'KATS > >is escapism, although themes that occur in life are explored. I > >just don't really want to see the view out of my own particular > >window duplicated verbatim on the screen! > > I agree completely with you on this one! :-) > Actually, the interaction between the main characters on a > personal basis provides for some very entertaining moments. > Each time the writers give us a little glimpse into the "every-day" > life of TBone & Razor, the characters become _more_ believable > and not just a "robot" who goes out & does a job 1, 2, 3... > It adds a "three-dimensional" aspect to the character & > personality of each of them. I would actually prefer to see > more of this in each episode! But given the 22 min. barrier, I'm > sure it's really difficult for the writers. Despite all the monster-battles, cool drawings, music and action - know what I like about the KAT guys most? Scenes like the "Chili-Pepper Eating Competition", and the one where they're trying to outdo eachother in the centrifuge. Nobody writes character stuff like that anymore, and these are the scenes that stick, and are usually the ones I show to people who've never seen 'KATS. Tremblay's started off with the characters and built up, not with the situation and filled up the scenery - it shows. 22 minute ac/adv is hard to write for, you're essentially stuck in the "short story" format that we all learned in High School English, but you also have to incorporate the commercial breaks in strategic places without breaking up the pacing. It looks easy, it isn't. The scenes like the ones I noted above were fought for by the writers, because they knew how much the audience would appreciate them - the three piece crowd just wanted to sell toys. Andy (guess we're all on at the same time...this is like IRC!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 00:44:01 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA21640 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 00:44:00 -0400 From: Tanya Rebecca Habeck Message-Id: <9504250448.AA02672@csd4.csd.uwm.edu> Subject: Re: A Short Movie Scene To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Mon, 24 Apr 1995 23:48:00 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 24, 95 06:55:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1507 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Hi! Paul Deisinger here (this is a friends account) > > The "Mountain Tours" bus: is it just me, or did all of the passengers > > on the bus, including the driver, get killed in that scene? When the > > bus is thrown over the cliff, you hear the passengers as it lands in > > the chasm. A few scenes later (in real-time, this would hardly be > > enough for everyone to escape, provided they survived the bus's plunge > > down the cliff), one of the mummies throws the bus at an Enforcer > > chopper, destroying the bus (and chopper) in a large fireball. > > Got two phone calls on this, and had a, well...strongly worded > e-mail exchange. Those people didn't get out, and it was clearly > intended that way. I personally don't worry too much about defining > villains in terms that involve actual consequences, but this was quite > contrary to what usually gets by Broadcast Standards and Practices. I'm > going to call Christian on this one, I liked this ep immensely for the > animation (did have a kind of anime feel to it, didn't it?), story was > pretty good too, sure appreciate seeing characters as good as T-Bone and > Razor given enough respect to warrant this quality of stuff. I suppose > Turner begs to differ. > Actually, if you watch the scene, the bus passengers do escape. As Razor is using the TurboCats computer imaging to look over the overturned bus and mummy, right before the mummy smashes it you can see the passengers running off the top of the screen. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 02:50:20 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA22233 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 02:50:15 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 24 Apr 1995 15:55:31 EDT. <9504241855.AA23459@cisk> Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 02:53:54 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr25.025413edt.46605@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Dana Uehara: > I was talking with someone once who said he couldn't believe that the SWAT > Kats couldn't kill someone accidentally, especially if their misguided > missiles hit buildings and such. umm, I forget if the Kats even have traditional missiles. their special weapons don't seem likely to do much in the way of civilian casualties. it's easy enough to imagine a missile abort when they miss their target. given the number of villians/disasters that affect MegaKat City, maybe the civilians have regular bomb-shelter drills. mmm, there should probably be something like an airraid siren. the Enforcers seem as likely to do civilian casualties as the Kats. -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 03:00:11 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA22301 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:00:11 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:04:13 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: The world ended? Was everyone okay? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPQOEW4GH08X2FWC@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: AFFIRMATIVE!!!!! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 03:08:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA22320 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:08:14 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:12:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPQOOF2ON68X2FWC@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Hmmm.......Thats your job pal yer the weapons expert I just fly the Turbokat. :) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 03:25:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA22413 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:25:21 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 24 Apr 1995 00:57:14 EDT. Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 03:28:55 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr25.032913edt.46605@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill: > Felina aside for the moment, say Feral is wrongly accused of something as > suggested, and is suspended from the force pending an inquiry. The 'KAT > guys are no doubt happy that Feral's history, but something worse takes > his place, perhaps himself (or herself) being responsible for the > incident Feral is being blamed for? what's-his-name, Steel? would be good for this. can use this to explain why he isn't around in the second season. mmm, there was an episode that almost did this. Steel took over and tried to get Feral killed. > I don't really want to see a representation of average existence in > entertainment, the nature of cartoons like the 'KATS is escapism, yep, agreed. no reason escapism can't be complex though :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 04:30:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id EAA22574 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 04:30:21 -0400 Message-Id: <9504250834.AA01474@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 01:34:30 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. content-length: 1084 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Felix Lee writes: >Steel took over and tried to get Feral killed. Umm, well, I wouldn't say that Steele tried to get the commander killed. However, he *did* drag his feet in scrambling the Enforcer jets to rescue him when he sneaked on board Dark Kat's jet (cf. "The Wrath of Dark Kat"). And later, in combat, Steele hesitated in returning fire because, as he said, "I've never flown actual combat..." In other news, I've edited the list's configuration file. If this worked the way I think (or hope!) it did, the "Reply-To:" header should be removed from all future postings. I decided to do this because it appears that there have been too many accidental replies to the list that should have been personal email. Since the list server is automated, anything that gets sent out gets immediately redistributed to everyone else on the list (i.e., no chance to reroute misdirected mail before it goes out). -- ================= Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================ "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 07:55:52 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id HAA22919 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 07:55:51 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 07:59:51 -0400 Message-Id: <199504251159.HAA18146@unix3.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Gratuitous violence? Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: -Swat Kats is a show that came out the "Johnny Quest snydorme" the age -when Johnny Quest dominated the air waves with his non-superhero like -ablites. Ah, yes. Johnny Quest. Race snatching up a Tommy gun and mowing down wave after wave of advancing Horrible Oriental Villains (H.O.V.'s). Now THAT was good old-fashioned gratuitous violence! But at least it showed the effects of pointing a submachine gun at a person and pulling the trigger. Now, indeed, the Kats do seem to be of the same ilk: ordinary fellows who possess high-tech weaponry (and obviously some high-level funding on the sly!) and know how to use it. But notice a subtle difference. The Kats rarely (if ever) kill anyone. The death and devastation in MegaKat City is always caused by the Nasty People -- train-eating bacteria, bus-throwing mummies -- who are then dispatched by these ordinary citizens who are willing to roll their sleeves up and fight. Nice message, IMHO From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 09:25:13 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23277 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 09:25:04 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 06:32:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr25.025413edt.46605@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > umm, I forget if the Kats even have traditional missiles. their > special weapons don't seem likely to do much in the way of civilian > casualties. They do have traditional missiles, "Chaos in Crystal": Razor; "I'll finish off those drones the old fashioned way!" Reaches to weaps panel, presses button, "Plain Old Missile" is selected. Camera cuts to TKAT EXT and you see the missile deployed, dropping down a couple of feet from the weapons bay before igniting, just for long enough to catch that Razor had scrawled "From Razor With Love" on the outside. Who can say he knew he was going to end up using it on a drone? I like that guy. > it's easy enough to imagine a missile abort when they miss their > target. Yeah, I kind of wondered about this too. I don't know about air-to-air, but I know the Tomahawks and some of the heavy BGM and cruise stuff has self-destruct. Hound-dogs, and Hawkeyes and the Shrike's and stuff may also. Another question for the Brothers Tremblay. > given the number of villians/disasters that affect MegaKat City, maybe > the civilians have regular bomb-shelter drills. mmm, there should > probably be something like an airraid siren. > > the Enforcers seem as likely to do civilian casualties as the Kats. Heh! The Enforcers are more than likely to cause the civilian casualties, if from nothing else than injuries received by the populace when the daily quota of choppers falls out of the sky. Andy (MegaKat City's taxes go up threefold everytime Feral says the famous "Bring me chopper backup!") From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 09:34:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23332 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 09:34:55 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: The world ended? Was everyone okay? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPQOEW4GH08X2FWC@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995 WKOZIOL@delphi.com wrote: > AFFIRMATIVE!!!!! ...heh,heh. The anti-violence crusade on TV hit a nerve with me, glad someone else agrees. Lets just convince Congress, the FCC, and our CRTC. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 09:44:16 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23393 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 09:44:15 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 06:51:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Complex is hard in 22 mins, but 44? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr25.032913edt.46605@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > what's-his-name, Steel? would be good for this. can use this to > explain why he isn't around in the second season. I liked the Steel character, though he's a creep. I have some cop and national security friends, and such people as Steel are around, and for much the same reasons I put in the fanfic thing. > yep, agreed. > > no reason escapism can't be complex though :) I thought "Cry Turmoil" was really odd in this respect. You see the plot at face value, T-Bone playing along with Turmoil to destroy the weapon, and most importantly, to save Razor - but the end scene in the jail cell with Turmoil reading T-Bone's note...that screamed "complex". This happens too. I know someone who's a prison guard, and they have some good friends among the inmates - very odd concerning the situation, something I suppose the writer (Falk) was trying to explore regarding T-Bone and Turmoil (would've been similar had he been able to keep Feral in the T-Bone role). "Turmoil 2" was going to extend this further - that would've been an episode and a half - and would've given you all the "complex" you could handle! Maybe I can get a script off someone, hmmm... Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 09:51:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA23416 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 09:51:20 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 06:58:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504250834.AA01474@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Umm, well, I wouldn't say that Steele tried to get the commander killed. To quote Lt. Steel, ..."that's 'Steel'...with two 'e''s..." > However, he *did* drag his feet in scrambling the Enforcer jets to rescue > him when he sneaked on board Dark Kat's jet (cf. "The Wrath of Dark Kat"). My favourite line from this ep comes from Feral regarding this: "Lights against you all the way, Steel?" Haha! > And later, in combat, Steele hesitated in returning fire because, as he > said, "I've never flown actual combat..." Yep. He got promoted because his family had cash, and he knew people. It's a blueprint followed by many corporations and police forces. The "Country Club" style of management - current worst offender: Disney. > there have been too many accidental replies to the list that should have > been personal email. Since the list server is automated, anything that Actually, what I've caught happening is duplication because someone doesn't notice that the cc line contains the same line as the response header - and sends it to the list, then c.c's it to the list again, or the original poster. Result's the same, you get two. No big deal, bugs to work out is all. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 10:04:37 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA23507 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 10:04:35 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 07:12:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Violence? A 5% gratuity is considered polite... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504251159.HAA18146@unix3.netaxs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995 flogistn@netaxs.com wrote: > Ah, yes. Johnny Quest. Race snatching up a Tommy gun and mowing down > wave after wave of advancing Horrible Oriental Villains (H.O.V.'s). > Now THAT was good old-fashioned gratuitous violence! But at least it > showed the effects of pointing a submachine gun at a person and pulling > the trigger. Yeah, it did! And I know someone who knew Doug Wildey, and this was only the tip of the iceberg in terms of what was intended. > Now, indeed, the Kats do seem to be of the same ilk: ordinary fellows who > possess high-tech weaponry (and obviously some high-level funding on the > sly!) and know how to use it. But notice a subtle difference. The Kats > rarely (if ever) kill anyone. The death and devastation in MegaKat City is > always caused by the Nasty People -- train-eating bacteria, bus-throwing > mummies -- who are then dispatched by these ordinary citizens who are willing > to roll their sleeves up and fight. Yes. Exactly. Too many cartoons etc teaching people to be McSheep, and we all know what happens to sheep. These guys are individuals, they think on their feet, they make intelligent choices, and they aren't afraid to recognize something wrong and correct it. If that starts to be labelled "evil" by people who think they know what's best for us, well...let's just say some of us won't be "sheep McNuggets" for their dining pleasure. > Nice message, IMHO Agreed. And one that's been shared by police officers protecting the public, soldiers stopping the threat of Fascism, and reasonable, responsible citizens who CAN actually tell the difference between the violence involved in holding up a 7-11, and that involved in protecting friends, neighbours, and family. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 10:38:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA23712 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 10:38:38 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 07:46:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Ted@Twit.stupid.decision.com wishes to say... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Hi all KATS fans. Had an interesting half an hour conversation with Hanna-Barbera yesterday, here's the gist of it: In a good-news/bad news type of thing, all the SWATKATS production materiel has been sent to Turner Home Video. I don't know if this is necessarily a bad idea, there's been a big shakeup in Afternoon Entertainment this year, and other people are doing the same things with their current stuff (can't go on about that right now). Victoria McCollum over there is going to find out for me which six eps will be first released to video. Buzz Potemkin has been reassigned to New York from LA, so he's out of the 'KATS loop, as is Victoria apparently - she's working on the "shorts" thing. I asked her what she felt about the SK cancellation happening as it did (she's production manager for the show), and she said "...I've worked on a lot of shows...it's a job...but some should've gone on a lot longer than they did..." 'nuff said. Fan Mail. They've just done a major overhaul of the fan-mail system for the 'KATS and everything else. They didn't realize there were internet fans, a situation I cleared up in a hurry, and they are going to try and get someone in charge of answering 'KATS mail. The guy I was supposed to talk to won't be back from NewYork until Thursday, but the second-in-command told me that "...if people can take the time to write, you can be sure we're going to answer...". The fanmail ops have been taken over by the "Classic Cartoons" division of H-B, and they have everything hooked into a computer, and all the fan-mail is entered into it. The age, sex and expressed opinions of the letter-writer are entered into this thing, and will be used by the marketing people to determine what stays on the air, and what doesn't, as well as giving them an idea for future projects. They have "about 4000" in there now, and they can sort by any means to come up with the info they need. I asked about 'KATS fan mail, and he said they have yet to go through "boxes and boxes" since it was handed over to their division (couple of days ago). They intend to set up something on Internet to allow fans to write regarding 'KATS, I'll work on that with two of the guys on the list that did so much work regarding the fan-stuff already, and H-B may get interested enough for an "Offical Fan Club", and maybe I can get them interested in a WWW site. Write letters, people - if you think they don't do any good, re-read the above: even Victoria McCollum said that "...shows cancelled..(like this) have been revived by fan letters..." Next. Comics Scene reported the layoff figures after cancellation to be "...23 in house artists, including half the background department, and 75 freelancers.." H-B says they didn't have more than 12 freelancers that they could think of, and that the laid-off personnel were put "on-call", as their "style of art" (read "quality") "wasn't currently needed for on-going projects...". Disney snapped up one displaced artist immediately, Warner Features is looking at a couple of others - I really don't know how to interpret this. Disney just laid off a ton of experienced people as well. Anyway, don't mistake the above as "false hopes", you know as much as I do know. Andy _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it's SAD (really)..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 17:14:23 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id RAA27928 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 17:14:07 -0400 Message-Id: <9504252118.AA07943@cisk> X-Sender: duehara@cisk.atmos.ucla.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 14:18:17 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: metalfox@su1.in.net (Ryan Fields) (by way of duehara@cisk.atmos.ucla.edu (Dana Uehara)) Subject: RE: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... content-length: 757 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >I was talking with someone once who said he couldn't believe that the SWAT >Kats couldn't kill someone accidentally, especially if their misguided >missiles hit buildings and such. While this may be true, they've never >been *aware* of civilian casualties resulting from their missiles until the >episode "Razor's Edge." Any comments on this? I also find it a little hard to belive that of all the buildings that have been hit, every single one was unoccupied...unless the SWATKats only fly on Sundays. :-) /\/|ET/\L F0X ******************************************************** *"Just because you're paranoid don't mean they're not * *after you." - Kurt Cobain * ******************************************************** From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 18:37:39 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA28484 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 18:37:37 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 12:41:42 HST Message-Id: <9504252241.AA08870@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Original question: >I was talking with someone once who said he couldn't believe that the SWAT >Kats couldn't kill someone accidentally, especially if their misguided >missiles hit buildings and such. While this may be true, they've never >been *aware* of civilian casualties resulting from their missiles until the >episode "Razor's Edge." Any comments on this? Many have commented so far that it is "hard to believe" that the SWAT Kats could not kill someone accidentally. I am not refuting this belief; where explosives are involved, damage inevitably occurs. However-- The facts in the episodes indicate that the SWAT Kats have *not* injured any innocent civilians. Suppose instead that they have. Then Feral has legal cause of action against the SWAT Kats, and as such, he should arrest them on the spot. (Example when he did have cause of action: episode involving the dual universe.) However, you will notice that Feral *doesn't* arrest the SWAT Kats when he encounters them in general. Furthermore, Feral *does* realize that they are an asset to the city (cf. Andy's story--if you accept that it is based on the series, then whatever reference he used is valid support for this statement). In addition, the SWAT Kats themselves have at least two reasons, to wit, *not* to harm innocent civilians. One is their characterization as "good" guys. (Consider, if Razor had never found out that the two civilians hurt in "Razor's Edge" were working for Dark Kat, wouldn't Razor have turned himself in?) Simply for moral concerns, it would be "wrong" to harm innocents. Another is their duty--possibly self-imposed--to keep themselves available *as* protectors of the city. Given the paragraph above, if the SWAT Kats were brought up on (possibly defensible) charges for killing anyone, they wouldn't be able to defend the city, would they? Well, you may argue, they could get out on bail. Perhaps, but Feral would do his official duty by insisting that the SWAT Kats be held without bail--manslaughter is a sufficiently serious offense to merit the possibility of holding without bail. In summary: You're welcome to assume what you will about civilian deaths. I wouldn't doubt that the bad guys certainly do kill innocent civilians. But the SWAT Kats have a realistic reason to avoid hurting innocents at all costs. Because they act as private citizens, they can be tried as such. They cannot *afford* to make that kind of mistake. Razor *knows* this, as we have seen. And if they had *ever* made such a mistake, they would be in jail, quite possibly because they'd turn themselves in--if not, they'd be arrested soon enough. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 20:00:55 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA28778 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:00:46 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:04:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPRNVQBYYQ9ANYFA@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Well look at it this way, everytime when Feral says, "Bring me chopper backup" at least the economy if Mega Kat City is really booming thanks to Feral. I mean take the factory that builds the Enforcer's choppers and jets. Those kats are getting some serious overtime. In fact these are the hidden heros of Mega Kat City cause it seams that there are building them as fast as Feral is in destroying them. Now thats a hero for ya!!! Getting back to the Swat Kats weapons, I'm surpize that Dana fail to mention that Razor's favorite missle is the "Plain Old Missle." And on the missle's body it reads "From Razor with love." From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 20:02:58 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA28792 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:02:57 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:07:04 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: The world ended? Was everyone okay? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPRO42TRA09ANYFA@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I hope Dana has a SERIOUS supply of the "Plain Old Missles" for convincing Congress, the FCC, your CRTC. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 20:07:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA28882 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:07:49 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:11:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPRO70SORI9ANYFA@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: What do you mean that Steele wasn't trying to kill Feral?!? He was hoping that the Darkkat Dominions would do the dirty work for him so he can get Feral's job. Steele acted like his name but we found out at the end that he had to no stomach for battle. He was a frail kitten and because of this it made Feral's character more likable cause deep down he knows that T-Bone & Razor gets the job done and are not cowards like Steele. Walt From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 20:29:05 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA29023 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:29:04 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 14:33:14 HST Message-Id: <9504260033.AA09931@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net, kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >> Umm, well, I wouldn't say that Steele tried to get the commander killed. > To quote Lt. Steel, ..."that's 'Steel'...with two 'e''s..." Hm. Since we've only *heard* the name, I suppose it could be Lieutenant "Stele" as well. Given the available information so far, I would agree with Andy for the spelling which matches an English word. However, a more authoritative source might be the end credits for the second season. If you, dear reader, have seen the lieutenant's name in any second season episodes, please enlighten us with the correct spelling. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 23:20:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA29483 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 23:20:10 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:27:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPRO70SORI9ANYFA@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995 WKOZIOL@delphi.com wrote: > What do you mean that Steele wasn't trying to kill Feral?!? He was hoping that the Darkkat Dominions would do the dirty work for him so > he can get Feral's job. Steele acted like his name but we found out at the > end that he had to no stomach for battle. He was a frail kitten and because of this it made > Feral's character more likable cause deep down he knows that T-Bone & Razor > gets the job done and are not cowards like Steele. I would have to guess that Steel hadn't thought it out all the way through, and was just waiting for events to unfold (though its treated very shallowly in "Wrath"...you just see him after Feral's job). Feral knowing who the SwatKats actually are? Hmm...see JH's post following this one. It's obvious he can see a use for them, look in the same episode where Steel says "Look Commander, the SwatKats are...(running? turning tail?)" and Feral replies: "This is no time to gloat, you idiot..." 'KAT guys balance the odds, and as long as Feral can still publicly trash them, his purposes are served as well. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Tue Apr 25 23:42:20 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA29524 for kats-ll; Tue, 25 Apr 1995 23:42:20 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:50:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504252241.AA08870@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Jonathan Higa wrote: > However, you will notice that Feral *doesn't* arrest the SWAT Kats when he > encounters them in general. Furthermore, Feral *does* realize that they are > an asset to the city (cf. Andy's story--if you accept that it is based on > the series, then whatever reference he used is valid support for this > statement). Someone pointed out to me on the phone that the reason the end of "Metal Urgency" plays so well is because Feral silences Mac and Molly rather than learning who the SwatKats are. I interpreted that another way. Feral isn't stupid, though his actions aren't always well thought-out ("no, it's desperate, and it's stupid...), and I think he must know who the 'KAT guys really are, but no one has confirmed it, so he feels no use for action. I personally feel that had he heard it from Mac and Molly, though perhaps no one else would've overheard their conversation, he would have felt bound to do something because he now knew for certain, whereas he had only previously strongly suspected. This is the part of the "some rules couldn't be broken by anyone - not even himself - but Steel broke them all" line that's applicable: Feral isn't obligated to act on his suspicions, but being a basically honor-bound and disciplined sort, if he was told who the KAT guys were, he'd be forced to act. This is one of the rules his character couldn't break for anyone. I left it purposely ambiguous at the end, though his actions, in my mind, leave little doubt he knows their identities. > In addition, the SWAT Kats themselves have at least two reasons, to wit, > *not* to harm innocent civilians. One is their characterization as "good" > guys. (Consider, if Razor had never found out that the two civilians hurt > in "Razor's Edge" were working for Dark Kat, wouldn't Razor have turned Razor is my favourite character on the show, hands down, specifically for this reason in terms of his nature. He *would* have turned himself in. He took a huge chance just going to the hospital. It's not a character weakness, it's a strength. T-Bone strikes me as being honourable, and he would've felt bad, but I think he would have been more likely to chalk it up as "it happened, what could we do about it? We did the best we could, and it was an unfortunate accident." It's the attitude cops and soldiers have to take to be able to do 99 percent good against the one percent "collateral damage" - but Razor's character wouldn't let him sleep nights even for the one percent. > innocents. Another is their duty--possibly self-imposed--to keep themselves > available *as* protectors of the city. Given the paragraph above, if the > SWAT Kats were brought up on (possibly defensible) charges for killing > anyone, they wouldn't be able to defend the city, would they? You'd end up in an "end justifies the means" confrontation here. A similar scene to above plays out in the Edward Woodward movie "Breaker Morant", where they're up on similar charges, and even though they face the death penalty, they're let out long enough to repel an enemy attack, then re-incarcerated to await execution. > Well, you may argue, they could get out on bail. Perhaps, but Feral would do > his official duty by insisting that the SWAT Kats be held without > bail--manslaughter is a sufficiently serious offense to merit the > possibility of holding without bail. That'd be pretty much a given concerning the offense I was picturing. More of the character-dev stuff could occur if they HAD to be let out to combat something, perhaps exonerating themselves in the process. > cannot *afford* to make that kind of mistake. Razor *knows* this, as we have Razor *does* know this, I just wish "Razor's Edge" could've been expanded somehow to include T-Bone's perspective. That's the problem with 23 eps as opposed to the 65 intended - all the threads are in place for future stories along these lines, but no one was allowed to sew them into anything. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 00:29:31 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA29796 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 00:29:30 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 25 Apr 1995 20:04:56 EDT. <01HPRNVQBYYQ9ANYFA@delphi.com> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 00:33:10 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr26.003326edt.45927@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: WKOZIOL: > Well look at it this way, everytime when Feral says, "Bring me > chopper backup" at least the economy if Mega Kat City is really > booming thanks to Feral. I mean take the factory that builds the > Enforcer's choppers and jets. heh. but who pays for it? there's a reason Manx keeps wooing those foreign investors. -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 00:42:18 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA00160 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 00:42:18 -0400 Message-Id: <9504260446.AA13928@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 21:46:37 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: "Steele," "Steel," or "Stele"? Or none of the above? content-length: 832 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Jonathan Higa writes: > Given the available information so far, I would agree with Andy for >the spelling which matches an English word. However, a more authoritative >source might be the end credits for the second season. If you, dear reader, >have seen the lieutenant's name in any second season episodes, please >enlighten us with the correct spelling. Trouble is, the Lieutenant didn't appear in *any* of the second-season episodes, which list all of the main characters (and their respective voices). Feral's niece, Felina, replaced Steel(e?), but the latter only appeared in the first season, where there was no breakdown of the voice credits. -- ================= Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================ "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 00:58:19 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA00237 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 00:58:18 -0400 Message-Id: <9504260502.AA13994@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 22:02:36 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Kat weaponry, revisited... content-length: 1028 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: WKOZIOL@delphi.com writes: >Getting back to the Swat Kats weapons, I'm surpize that Dana fail to mention >that Razor's favorite missle is the "Plain Old Missle." And on the missle's >body it reads "From Razor with love." First off, Razor's favorite missile isn't the "Plain Old Missile," otherwise he'd use it all the time. I'd say he prefers using either the Octopus or Slicer Missiles more. He's only used this particular missile *once*, but as far as I know he's never used it since. The background for this comment is simple: on two MUCKs (FurryMUCK and FurToonia, for those of you who aren't familiar with mucking) I play Razor and Walt plays T-Bone. One invention (which is "throwable", i.e., you can actually throw it to someone else) is the Plain Old Missile, basically a replica of the same missile used in the episode "Chaos In Crystal." -- ================= Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================ "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 01:07:37 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA00285 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 01:07:37 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Complex is hard in 22 mins, but 44? In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 25 Apr 1995 09:51:42 EDT. Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 01:11:41 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr26.011148edt.45932@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: well, The Simpsons manages to do pretty complex things in 22 mins. but I guess satire and comedy are easier to dense-pack than drama.. Andy Hill: > "Turmoil 2" was going to extend this further - that would've been an > episode and a half - and would've given you all the "complex" you > could handle! Maybe I can get a script off someone, hmmm... that would be cool. please try. (and I promise to read your fanfic once I prune my emailbox down to manageable size :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 01:40:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA00392 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 01:40:49 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 19:40:45 HST Message-Id: <9504260540.AA14264@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Excellent observations, Andy! You're also right about the possibility of having the SWAT Kats continue to defend the city while in custody. (Side note: It seems morbid indeed to me that the saviors of the city might be executed someday--but it's not without precedent.) Fortunately for the SWAT Kats and the city, nobody seems to have been hurt, though. They're still flying freely, even if not on our TVs... -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 01:49:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id BAA00423 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 01:49:14 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 19:49:10 HST Message-Id: <9504260549.AA14288@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net, kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Re: "Steele," "Steel," or "Stele"? Or none of the above? Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >Trouble is, the Lieutenant didn't appear in *any* of the second-season >episodes, which list all of the main characters (and their respective >voices). Feral's niece, Felina, replaced Steel(e?), but the latter only >appeared in the first season, where there was no breakdown of the voice >credits. (giggle) Oh, well. I wasn't taking my alternative seriously anyway. As long as I spell it with "two _e_'s," I don't care ... and I won't draw attention to any differences in spelling anyhow. I like to pick a more analytical class of nit. (grin) -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 02:04:07 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA00544 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 02:04:07 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 20:04:03 HST Message-Id: <9504260604.AA14342@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> X-Sender: higa@math.hawaii.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: kats@sard.mv.net From: higa@math.hawaii.edu (Jonathan Higa) Subject: Does Feral know? Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: In addition to Andy's good support for the argument that Feral knows who the SWAT Kats are (side note: it's been a while since I've seen "Metal Urgency"), I'll add the following heuristic argument: Jake and Chance were Enforcers, right? So, shouldn't you think Feral ought to know their voices by now? :) Feral's a bright man, and there aren't many other "hot shots" out there. Oh, that reminds me. Did Feral ever refer to Chance and Jake as "hot shots" also? I'm thinking in particular of the episode involving Dark Kat, with the flashback to the SWAT Kats' Enforcer days. If so, it's another clue indicating that Feral probably knows. -- Jonathan Higa, higa@math.hawaii.edu, http://math.hawaii.edu/~higa/ From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 05:06:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA00935 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 05:06:13 -0400 Message-Id: <9504260906.AA14877@cisk> Subject: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Wed, 26 Apr 95 2:06:08 PDT From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1005 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Tanya Habek writes: > Actually, if you watch the scene, the bus passengers do escape. As Razor > is using the TurboCats computer imaging to look over the overturned bus > and mummy, right before the mummy smashes it you can see the passengers > running off the top of the screen. I rewatched the episode and noticed this (but you really have to look to see it, because you're seeing the view through Razor's visor, which is itself dim). *However*, this doesn't mean there still isn't death in the series; the bus is smashed into one of the Enforcer choppers, which in turn explodes. Most likely the chopper wasn't hovering there by remote control (in other words, *somebody* had to be piloting it) -- and certainly nobody would have had time to evacuate in the few seconds it took for the mummy to throw the bus at the chopper. Comments? -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 10:26:36 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01788 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:26:31 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 07:30:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Kat weaponry, revisited... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504260502.AA13994@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > First off, Razor's favorite missile isn't the "Plain Old Missile," > otherwise he'd use it all the time. I'd say he prefers using either the > Octopus or Slicer Missiles more. He's only used this particular missile > *once*, but as far as I know he's never used it since. Twice, for him. The second was in "Razor's Edge" when he blew out the ground underneath the "Black Widow" thingy of DarkKat's, then later filling it with water. T-Bone, I believe, also finished off DarkKat's jet in "Wrath of DarkKat" with Plain old Missile when Razor was dropping downwards along with the bomb. Weaps list entries not mentioned: GROUNDHOG MISSILE (From Razor's Edge) DRILLBIT MISSILE (From Razor's Edge) Andy (who wishes the damn mailprog would learn to append the sig at the bottom instead of the top of the file...) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 10:39:05 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01867 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:39:04 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 07:43:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Complex is hard in 22 mins, but 44? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr26.011148edt.45932@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > well, The Simpsons manages to do pretty complex things in 22 mins. > but I guess satire and comedy are easier to dense-pack than drama.. Yep, exactly. Comedy stuff is normally a string of jokes, funny unto themselves, that follow a central thread in the particular episode or that run concurrently in the series. SwatKats has some of these threads, like the Feral/'KAT guys antagonism, the "personal" history with their involvement with DarkKat, etc. but comedy doesn't require the complex setups you need in ac/adv - which sometimes eat up 30 percent of the show. > Andy Hill: > > "Turmoil 2" was going to extend this further - that would've been an > > episode and a half - and would've given you all the "complex" you > > could handle! Maybe I can get a script off someone, hmmm... This may be one of the ones I'm getting in the mail, don't know. > that would be cool. please try. (and I promise to read your fanfic > once I prune my emailbox down to manageable size :) Heh! I've got almost 30 msgs a day sometimes, I know a lot of people who haven't read it either. Not everyone's into fanfic, either - so its no big deal if people don't read the thing, I won't be pissed off or anything. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 10:51:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01951 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:51:44 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 07:55:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504260540.AA14264@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Excellent observations, Andy! You're also right about the possibility of > having the SWAT Kats continue to defend the city while in custody. (Side > note: It seems morbid indeed to me that the saviors of the city might be > executed someday--but it's not without precedent.) Why, thank you! No, its not without precedent. I think that scenario would make a fine story idea, too. > Fortunately for the SWAT Kats and the city, nobody seems to have been hurt, > though. They're still flying freely, even if not on our TVs... More on this, from someone who's doing the 'KATS article for Animato. Word of warning: none of this should be repeated to ANY newsgroup, regardless of how "secure" you consider it. The posts to r.a.a. (including some of my more, well..."direct" ones) and a lot of the mail to Turner Group and Hanna-Barbera has been very sharp in it's criticism on Turner Group regarding the shows cancellation, and in the same breath has heaped praise on the show. "Damage Control" is starting at Turner, and everyone is clamming up concerning the show (Victoria McCollum's change in "note" was interesting, but I didn't think anything of it until day before yesterday). Anyway, this article of my Ohio friend's has been in development for awhile, and he'd earlier obtained quotes from Davis Doi, the producer, and Chris Zimmerman (voices production, I think). He called H-B up at the last minute to make sure he could attribute the quotes to them, and they said: "um...(name)...we really wish you wouldn't..." Turns out, that because of the mail and the posts, Hanna-Barbera and Turner Group believe, mistakenly, that this article will echo some of the sentiments expressed on Internet and the fan-mail box. They asked for a copy of the article to be forwarded to their PR person, not to suggest changes, just to ensure it doesn't torch Turner Group to the point someone may lose their job. Get the idea that someone is scratching the fur behind their ears going "oops...I think we made a Boo-Boo...". Again, I wasn't asked not to repeat any of that, but Turner Corporate and Hanna-Barbera seem to be a bit unhappy with eachother, and there's a reason I've tried to keep all the blame fully resting in the lap of Turner Group - that's where it belongs. So, keep it off the groups please, lest it reflect badly on H-B. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 10:54:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA01968 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:54:31 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 07:58:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Does Feral know? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504260604.AA14342@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Jonathan Higa wrote: > Oh, that reminds me. Did Feral ever refer to Chance and Jake as "hot shots" > also? I'm thinking in particular of the episode involving Dark Kat, with the > flashback to the SWAT Kats' Enforcer days. If so, it's another clue > indicating that Feral probably knows. It's in "Wrath of Dark Kat", and good question, I'll have to re-watch that once I get home and see if he does, hmmm. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 10:59:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA02034 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:59:43 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 08:03:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504260906.AA14877@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > by remote control (in other words, *somebody* had to be piloting it) -- > and certainly nobody would have had time to evacuate in the few seconds > it took for the mummy to throw the bus at the chopper. > > Comments? If that Enforcer got out, I'd be amazed, but another example is "Unlikely Alloys", Enforcer tanks got crushed flat, and more than a few choppers, airborne and piloted, got destroyed with no one hitting the silk. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 11:12:52 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA02101 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 11:12:51 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f9e62dc25f1002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 95 10:12:28 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? Content-Length: 1028 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Dana writes: >I rewatched the episode and noticed this (but you really have to look >to see it, because you're seeing the view through Razor's visor, which >is itself dim). *However*, this doesn't mean there still isn't death >in the series; the bus is smashed into one of the Enforcer choppers, >which in turn explodes. Most likely the chopper wasn't hovering there >by remote control (in other words, *somebody* had to be piloting it) -- >and certainly nobody would have had time to evacuate in the few seconds >it took for the mummy to throw the bus at the chopper. One of the mummies also grabbed an Enforcer 'copter and tossed it into the side of a cliff. I didn't see any parachutes from that one! :) This was one of my favorites, which I like to call the "Aztec Mummy" episode. It also has one of my favorite lines. After the TurboKat is damaged and their turbo-cycle gets sliced up in the pyramid, Razor comments to T-Bone, "We're having a bad vehicle day, bud!" I feel like that sometimes myself. :) -Tim From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 11:15:55 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA02130 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 11:15:55 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 95 10:08:40 CDT From: lynn@gentire.com (Ian Lynn) Message-Id: <9504261508.AA22907@sv1.gentire.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > If that Enforcer got out, I'd be amazed, but another example is >"Unlikely Alloys", Enforcer tanks got crushed flat, and more than a few >choppers, airborne and piloted, got destroyed with no one hitting the silk. I guess it's kinda like the G.I. Joe theory, a plane would get blown up and as comes crashing to the ground, the pilot with chute deployed would come floating to the ground. I still get peaved about this anti-violence crappola. We, who grew up in the '70's and early '80's, survived seeing Wiley smacking the ground with out too many adverse effects. That's where my appreciation for Japanese anime developed, they aren't afraid to show a little real life. That's whyt I'm surprised Turner lets G-force on the Cartoon Network. Granted, its a watered down version of the original, but they still blantantly show death on the show. Vent the anger-- Ian From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 11:20:07 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA02185 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 11:20:06 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 08:24:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: ...it's all so clear to me now... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Some kind soul, part of our list, forwarded a tape containing a few eps, one of which was "Unlikely Alloys". First off, I have never seen a second season episode unscrambled - you can hear all the dialogue, and kind of make out the picture, but can't really appreciate the artwork because it's kind of "inverted" and wavy. I watched this unscrambled on the tape, and I found it really hard to breathe and watch at the same time - a tough feat with your mouth hanging open the whole time, awestruck. Holy sh**, I couldn't believe it! I thought some of the first season Mook stuff was outstanding, but this...this stuff, is going to earn Turner a few more letters. I don't know how many people have seen it, but look how the character models changed from the first season - they're a lot more anime, and a lot more "edgy" and "angular". This process started in "Razor's Edge", but was refined to an incredible extent by this ep, the last one completed. My only complaint is, the characters were so rigidly "on-model", that the faces lost some of the expressivity of the first season eps, in the attempt to keep them looking "cool" and "mean" (T-Bone looks like he dropped a few pounds between seasons, too - few less nachos I suspect). The "Zed" creature was as good as anything I've seen in anime, and the explosion when the mountainside was taken out was nothing short of incredible. Check out the scene where Feral leans in toward T-Bone, and T-Bone says: "You're not going to pin this one on us..." and Feral replies, as he turns away, "Actually, I was going to thank you, but I've changed my mind..." Feral's expression and body language is priceless, as is Razor's in the same scene. Goddamn, killing this show redefines the word "stupid"! Andy (sorry for "gushing", but TV has lacked this kind of stuff for so long, I'd forgotten what I'd been missing...) _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it's SAD (really)..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 11:24:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA02213 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 11:24:49 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 08:28:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "We're havin' a bad vehicle day, bud..." To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <2f9e62dc25f1002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995 fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > This was one of my favorites, which I like to call the "Aztec Mummy" > episode. It also has one of my favorite lines. After the TurboKat I haven't seen it yet, unscrambled that is, but its on my new tape from someone, so I'll catch it tonight... > is damaged and their turbo-cycle gets sliced up in the pyramid, Razor > comments to T-Bone, "We're having a bad vehicle day, bud!" I feel > like that sometimes myself. :) Heh. A few buds and myself rent out military vehicles to movies, and one day almost nothing would run properly, and I remember saying something very similar, though I think Razor is perhaps more polite than I was. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 13:11:27 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA03407 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 13:11:26 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 13:11:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: sonic@sard.mv.net, kats@sard.mv.net Subject: lists were deleted! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I accidently deleted all the mailing lists. But the last backup was last week. So the list of people on the list might not be current. Sorry about this guys. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 13:36:24 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA03586 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 13:36:23 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f9e847f0cc4002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 95 12:35:59 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: KATATONIC! Content-Length: 136 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Did my post about KATATONIC! go through? Since Paul says the lists were accidentally deleted, I'm thinking it may have gotten lost... From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 13:48:33 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id NAA03635 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 13:48:32 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 13:48:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: KATATONIC! In-Reply-To: <2f9e847f0cc4002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995 fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > > Did my post about KATATONIC! go through? Since Paul says the lists were > accidentally deleted, I'm thinking it may have gotten lost... There were a few that didn't go though. Your's was probably one of them. I don't see any postings by you in the archive. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 19:13:54 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA05807 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 19:13:45 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: "Steele," "Steel," or "Stele"? Or none of the above? In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 26 Apr 1995 01:49:10 EDT. <9504260549.AA14288@kahuna.math.hawaii.edu> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 19:02:36 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr26.191258edt.46094@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: just a little nitpick: "stele" _is_ an english word :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 22:17:57 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA06268 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 22:17:45 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 19:21:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: KATATONIC! To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <2f9e847f0cc4002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995 fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu wrote: > > Did my post about KATATONIC! go through? Since Paul says the lists were > accidentally deleted, I'm thinking it may have gotten lost... I got nothing off the list today, aside from this post and Ratman's comments about, well...YOU KNOW! (only kidding...) Andy (who once lost an entire wedding invite list...) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 23:00:08 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA06564 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:00:07 -0400 From: August Yang Message-Id: <199504270300.XAA23056@ritz.mordor.com> Subject: Where to find Kats in New York.... To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:00:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1548 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: There's this *fab*ulous pet store that... Just kidding. Actually, I made quite a pleasent discovery this morning after staying up half the night getting nothing done. Chanell 11 WPIX also known as the WB in New York is now showing the SWAT Kats at the ungodly hour of 5:30am on Wednesdays. Found this out after vegging on Robot Carnival on TNT (See? Turner does have *some* taste. Just not a heck of a lot.) Because SWAT Kats has a definate anime flavor (or influence) I had a great anime morning. (Only cost me 20 or 30 winks) Also, just to throw my two cents in on whether or not Feral knows if who the Kats are. I've always favored the opinion that not only does Feral know, he sent Jake and Chance to that particular Junk Yard *in hopes* they would become vigilantes. I know its weird, but if perhaps Feral was sick and tired of all the beauracracy that goes into police work. Because of his position, he can't go slagging punks like he would like to, but he can manipulate events to the extent that someone else could. Enter Jake and Chance, two rebelious pilots with the know-how to take down criminals effective if only the rules weren't standing in the way. All Feral would need is a semi-good excuse. August Paul Yang did manage to catch up on his sleep -- wntrmute@ritz.mordor.com | For my Life Public Relations and Official Test Audience for the FDC | Still ahead, "Have you any idea how successful censorship is on TV? | Pity me. -Queen Don't know the answer? Hm. Successful. Isn't it?" -Max Headroom From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Wed Apr 26 23:46:40 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA06701 for kats-ll; Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:46:39 -0400 Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 20:50:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Where to find vigilantes in New York.. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <199504270300.XAA23056@ritz.mordor.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, August Yang wrote: > Also, just to throw my two cents in on whether or not Feral knows if who > the Kats are. I've always favored the opinion that not only does Feral > know, he sent Jake and Chance to that particular Junk Yard *in hopes* > they would become vigilantes. I know its weird, but if perhaps Feral was > sick and tired of all the beauracracy that goes into police work. > Because of his position, he can't go slagging punks like he would like > to, but he can manipulate events to the extent that someone else could. August Paul Yang shows me that I'm not the only one who thought this. I always thought it was somewhat coincidental that all the makings of a snap-together TurboKat were dumped once a week by Burke and Murray right on the doorstep. Only drawback here is, originally it was just going to be a mechanic operation - Lance Falk threw in the idea of "military salvage" during a dev session with the Tremblays. This doesn't really affect the observation much, just kind of defines the time-frame the thought would've had to occur to the people "designing" Feral. > Enter Jake and Chance, two rebelious pilots with the know-how to take > down criminals effective if only the rules weren't standing in the way. > All Feral would need is a semi-good excuse. Yeah, this pretty much echo's my thoughts. He's not too eager to nail the 'KAT guys, even in Razor's Edge where he has the best reason, he lets Razor leave the hospital without explaining himself beyond saying "book 'em". > August Paul Yang did manage to catch up on his sleep Mordor is a busy place, just ask any Hobbit. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 02:36:43 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA07331 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 02:36:43 -0400 Message-Id: <9504270636.AA05089@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:36:42 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Bad vehicle, list and lab day... content-length: 2614 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: ... the story of today for yours truly. First off, this morning the listmail gets screwed up... then while trying to do some lab work a teflon bag breaks and a liquid nitrogen tank that *should* have been working goes !@#$%^. *sigh* Good thing I don't have to drive to and from campus, or something probably would have happened to my car as well. In any event, I received a couple of bounces that never made it through to the list, but I'll resend them. One is Andy's comment about "the second season showing less chutes than the first," and another is Tim Fay's announcement about KATATONIC, the _Kats_ fanzine. Paul: I accidently deleted all the mailing lists. Even if the last backup was last week, or the week prior, I don't think more than a handful of listers were lost. Hopefully those people who were dropped will realize the sudden decline in listmail (from prolific to zero) and will query me and/or rejoin the list. Andy: [Feral]'s not too eager to nail the 'KAT guys, even in Razor's Edge where he has the best reason, he lets Razor leave the hospital without explaining himself beyond saying "book 'em". Well, there's a very good reason for this. Feral wasn't even *in* the hospital at the time. It was someone else who Razor threw the masks to and said "book 'em" while he ran to rejoin his buddy. Most likely Feral was busy trying to stop Dark Kat from taking over the city. Look how the character models changed from the first season - they're a lot more anime, and a lot more "edgy" and "angular". This process started in "Razor's Edge", but was refined to an incredible extent by this ep, the last one completed. I noticed a definite anime influence in the series from the opening credits of the second-season episodes. Ironically, a few weeks before the second season episodes started, I was at a friend's place and he showed me an anime sequence that does a 360-degree pan around a character as he suits up. This is *exactly* what you see when Razor suits up as well, and this animation sequence has been reused several times in the second-season episodes ("Mutation City," for example). T-Bone looks like he dropped a few pounds between seasons, too - few less nachos I suspect. Either that or the flies he started to ingest (cf. "Mutation City") . Tho seriously, I've read that termites are a valuable source of fats and protein... -- ================= Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================ "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 02:50:25 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA07385 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 02:50:25 -0400 Message-Id: <9504270650.AA05176@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:50:25 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? content-length: 1785 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 08:35:28 -0700 (PDT) >From: Andy Hill >Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? >To: kats@sard.mv.net >In-Reply-To: <9504261508.AA22907@sv1.gentire.com> >Message-ID: >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > >On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, Ian Lynn wrote: > >> I guess it's kinda like the G.I. Joe theory, a plane would get blown up and >>as >> comes crashing to the ground, the pilot with chute deployed would come >>floating >> to the ground. >> >> I still get peaved about this anti-violence crappola. We, who grew up in the >> '70's and early '80's, survived seeing Wiley smacking the ground with out >>too many >> adverse effects. That's where my appreciation for Japanese anime developed, >> they aren't afraid to show a little real life. That's whyt I'm surprised >>Turner >> lets G-force on the Cartoon Network. Granted, its a watered down version of >>the >> original, but they still blantantly show death on the show. >> >> Vent the anger-- > > Speaking of changes, Christain Tremblay points to a folder full of >fan-mail and says "somethings they liked, some things they didn't - and >occasionally we went 'oh yeah, we didn't like that too much either'.." >This violence thing. Has anyone noticed that the second season eps seem >a little less concerned with showing 'chutes than the first? Think maybe >the fan-mail to H-B contained much the same (unanimous, I might add) >comments concerning violence on the show? Too bad that everyone >in the production end of things learned the lesson being taught, >and left Turner still standing at the blackboard after school banging out >the brushes. I hope he chokes on the dust. > >Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 02:51:50 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA07399 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 02:51:50 -0400 Message-Id: <9504270651.AA05184@cisk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Apr 1995 23:51:46 -0800 To: kats@sard.mv.net From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) Subject: KATATONIC! content-length: 1117 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu >Date: Wed, 26 Apr 95 10:33:53 -0500 >To: kats@sard.mv.net >Subject: KATATONIC! > >I guess now would be as good a time as any to announce KATATONIC!, a 'zine >dedicated to exploring the world of SWAT KATS! > >It's being put together by Kevin Stahnke, Bryant Velez, and myself. We're >creating a SWAT KATS 'doujinshi' (you 'otaku' reading this will recognize >the word; it means a Japanese-style fan publication). We plan to publish >a limited run of this 'zine and each issue will concentrate on a specific >SWAT KATS villain. Issue #1 will feature part 1 of Kevin's article on The >PastMaster. The issue will also feature art by Bryant and myself, along >with other features (like the "Mecha File" and "Character File"). > >We're getting the art and final drafts put together, and if anyone on the >list would like to contribute art, stories, or articles, please contact >me via e-mail. But please do so right away! We will have the first issue >of KATATONIC! available in time for A-Kon in Dallas, June 2-4 (Bryant, Kev, >and I will be there). Hope to hear from you soon! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 05:24:40 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA07784 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:24:39 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Complex is hard in 22 mins, but 44? In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 26 Apr 1995 10:43:01 EDT. Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:24:00 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr27.052408edt.46118@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I said: > well, The Simpsons manages to do pretty complex things in 22 mins. > but I guess satire and comedy are easier to dense-pack than drama.. Andy Hill: > but comedy doesn't require the complex setups you need in ac/adv - > which sometimes eat up 30 percent of the show. well, let me retract my statement a little. if you strip away the jokes in The Simpsons, there's usually substantial character drama going on. and sometimes they have two unrelated stories intertwined. hour-long drama series these days often have three or four things going on in one episode. so it should be possible to pack a complex story into 22 mins. (BTAS did it very well.) > Heh! I've got almost 30 msgs a day sometimes, oh, is that all? :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 05:28:53 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA07816 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:28:52 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: who knows the Kats? In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 25 Apr 1995 23:27:58 EDT. Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:28:30 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr27.052843edt.46115@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: so if Feral knows or suspects who the Kats are, then how about Callie? -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 05:41:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA07853 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:41:14 -0400 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Violence? A 5% gratuity is considered polite... In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 25 Apr 1995 10:12:03 EDT. Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:40:58 -0400 From: Felix Lee Message-Id: <95Apr27.054105edt.46118@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill: > Yes. Exactly. Too many cartoons etc teaching people to be McSheep, > and we all know what happens to sheep. umm, they die? don't wolves die too? :) -- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 05:45:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id FAA07875 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 05:45:32 -0400 Message-Id: <9504270945.AA05573@cisk> Subject: Re: who knows the Kats? To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Thu, 27 Apr 95 2:45:27 PDT In-Reply-To: <95Apr27.052843edt.46115@colossus.cse.psu.edu> from "Felix Lee" at Apr 27, 95 05:28:30 am From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1216 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Felix Lee writes: > so if Feral knows or suspects who the Kats are, then how about Callie? _Toon Magazine_ (Fall '94) reports that Callie doesn't know the SWAT Kats' secret identities, but I wouldn't bet on it. If you especially consider the episode "Night of the Dark Kat," when the pair use Callie's car (and Callie!) for a quick getaway, the dialogue goes something like: T-Bone: "This car's pretty fast, for a street machine." Callie: "Yeah, I have a couple of good mechanics who keep it tuned up for me..." T-Bone: "Too bad you can't keep the Turbokat running *this* smooth, Razor..." Interpret that any way you want; I'd say that from the above, Callie has just as good an idea, if not better, than Feral as to who the SWAT Kats really are. One thing's for sure: if Callie and Feral know who the SWAT Kats are, they make sure they don't slip up (i.e., calling the SWAT Kats by their real names, i.e., Chance and Jake) and let on that they know. (Actually, this would make an interesting 'what if' story, don't ya think? ;-) -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 09:53:59 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08462 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 09:53:59 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 15:29:07 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Message-ID: <9504251529.aa04565@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >> umm, I forget if the Kats even have traditional missiles. their >> special weapons don't seem likely to do much in the way of civilian >> casualties. > > They do have traditional missiles, "Chaos in Crystal": Razor; > > "I'll finish off those drones the old fashioned way!" I'm not fully up to speed on the show (yet!), but I have noted a number of instances of missiles with explosive warheads rather than exotic features. >> it's easy enough to imagine a missile abort when they miss their >> target. > > Yeah, I kind of wondered about this too. I don't know about >air-to-air, but I know the Tomahawks and some of the heavy BGM and cruise >stuff has self-destruct. Hound-dogs, and Hawkeyes and the Shrike's and >stuff may also. Another question for the Brothers Tremblay. Tactical missiles rarely have a self-destruct feature. The missile would not self-destruct when it missed a target because it doesn't know it missed (that is, the target did not pass close enough for fuze function). The only common application for self-destruct fuzes is in antiaircraft artillery (Baghdad fireaworks show), where the SD function is either timed or a function of projectile spin. Missing missiles in SK should cause lots of collateral damage even if they had a self-destruct, simply because they're being fired among buildings, where an SD feature wouldn't have time to function. >> the Enforcers seem as likely to do civilian casualties as the Kats. > > Heh! The Enforcers are more than likely to cause the civilian >casualties, if from nothing else than injuries received by the populace >when the daily quota of choppers falls out of the sky. Is it me, or do too many Enforcers successfully bail out of their helos? I know I've seen a few instances where they seem to go down with their aircraft, which is realistic, but there are some where they successfully get out, which is unlikely. Ed Rudnicki erudnick@pica.army.mil TLM addict FDC Bronx FDC Night Watchman From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 09:54:08 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08476 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 09:54:07 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 16:06:09 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. Message-ID: <9504251606.aa04673@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >> ...aah, don't know about this. Marketeers planning the toy lines >> generally (Disney) try to steer the shows course along the lines of >> confrontations with the villains that are likely to appear in Toys R Us. > >hmm. I guess I've been assuming that it's easy enough to create and >sell arbitrary action figures. but besides the development costs, >it's probably hard to pitch, say, a Callie figure at the 6-11 market. >(is there an April O'Neil figure? I can't remember seeing one >advertised. time to go digging in a toy store. just for research, of >course :) There are apparently several different April O'Neil figures, from what I've read on rec.toys.misc. An interesting phenomenon I've noted is that if figures are good, the toy collectors (and presumably the children who actually play with the toys :) will buy them regardless of whether they're associated with a series. I read a number of postings praising the Gargoyles figures from people who'd never seen the show. I don't know that a Callie figure would sell by itself in that manner, though :) Ed Rudnicki erudnick@pica.army.mil TLM addict FDC Bronx FDC Night Watchman From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 09:54:11 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id JAA08485 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 09:54:10 -0400 Date: Tue, 25 Apr 95 20:18:29 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Message-ID: <9504252018.aa05226@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >Well look at it this way, everytime when Feral says, "Bring me chopper backup" >at least the economy if Mega Kat City is really booming thanks to Feral. I >mean take the factory that builds the Enforcer's choppers and jets. Those >kats are getting some serious overtime. In fact these are the hidden heros >of Mega Kat City cause it seams that there are building them as fast as Feral >is in destroying them. Now thats a hero for ya!!! This sounds an awful lot like Harry Harrison's little bit about why bank robbery is good for the economy, in the "Stainless Steel Rat" series :) Actually Feral is hurting the economy. Those helos are being paid for by tax dollars. And the collateral damage is being paid for by insurance companies, who then charge higher premiums. So, as always, the middle class kats are paying for Feral's incompetence. >Getting back to the Swat Kats weapons, I'm surpize that Dana fail to mention >that Razor's favorite missle is the "Plain Old Missle." And on the missle's >body it reads "From Razor with love." It has the advantage of working, something the gimmicky ordnance doesn't always do. Ed Rudnicki erudnick@pica.army.mil TLM addict FDC Bronx FDC Night Watchman From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:03:04 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08607 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:03:03 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:07:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Bad vehicle, list and lab day... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504270636.AA05089@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Well, there's a very good reason for this. Feral wasn't even *in* the > hospital at the time. It was someone else who Razor threw the masks to and > said "book 'em" while he ran to rejoin his buddy. Most likely Feral was > busy trying to stop Dark Kat from taking over the city. Yeah, I wasn't too clear on this, I was really referring to Feral by extension, I had realized he wasn't present. He was, of course, trying to stop DarkKat at that moment. > anime sequence that does a 360-degree pan around a character as he suits > up. This is *exactly* what you see when Razor suits up as well, and this > animation sequence has been reused several times in the second-season > episodes ("Mutation City," for example). This 360 degree thing is a trademark of a certain anime house, the name of which escapes me at the moment. As far as "re-used" goes, the only thing I've only found mildly annoying is the re-use in the second season of the same shot of T-Bone sliding the throttle control forward, the variable-geometry TurboKat exhaust ports narrowing, and the TurboKat leaving the hangar. It's an unbelievable sequence, fantasic...but how often can you use the same frames? Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:31:24 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08777 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:31:23 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 95 10:27:33 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Where to find Kats in New York.... Message-ID: <9504271027.aa08778@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >Just kidding. Actually, I made quite a pleasent discovery this morning >after staying up half the night getting nothing done. Chanell 11 WPIX also >known as the WB in New York is now showing the SWAT Kats at the ungodly >hour of 5:30am on Wednesdays. Found this out after vegging on Robot Carnival >on TNT (See? Turner does have *some* taste. Just not a heck of a lot.) I beg to differ, after what he did to "Heavy Metal". As to the time being ungodly, don't you use a VCR? I don't think I've ever seen a Kats episode as it was broadcast, because I'm usually doing something when they're on. Besides, taping it lets you enjoy the many good scenes and blot out the commercials. VCRs and TV animation were made for each other :) Also, my apologies for my recent late responses. I was gone for a while, and there were problems with outgoing mail at my site. Ed Who _still_ doesn't know why he likes SK so much :) Ed Rudnicki erudnick@pica.army.mil TLM addict FDC Bronx FDC Night Watchman "You're getting brutal, Sark - brutal, and needlessly cruel." "Thank you, Master Cee!" --- (Tron) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:35:12 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08800 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:35:11 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:39:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: who knows the Kats? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504270945.AA05573@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > Felix Lee writes: > > so if Feral knows or suspects who the Kats are, then how about Callie? > > _Toon Magazine_ (Fall '94) reports that Callie doesn't know the SWAT > Kats' secret identities, but I wouldn't bet on it. If you especially > consider the episode "Night of the Dark Kat," when the pair use Callie's > car (and Callie!) for a quick getaway, the dialogue goes something like: > > T-Bone: "This car's pretty fast, for a street machine." > Callie: "Yeah, I have a couple of good mechanics who keep it tuned up > for me..." > T-Bone: "Too bad you can't keep the Turbokat running *this* smooth, > Razor..." > > Interpret that any way you want; I'd say that from the above, Callie has > just as good an idea, if not better, than Feral as to who the SWAT Kats > really are. I caught this ep scrambled, but I didn't think Callie "got it" right then. There's a scene in the "Giant Bacteria" where Callie starts talking about the fantastic job the 'KAT guys did, standing directly in front of Chance. Not sure you could have this scene just as written, if Callie secretly knew who they were. Hmm. I'll have to keep watching. > One thing's for sure: if Callie and Feral know who the SWAT Kats are, > they make sure they don't slip up (i.e., calling the SWAT Kats by their > real names, i.e., Chance and Jake) and let on that they know. (Actually, > this would make an interesting 'what if' story, don't ya think? ;-) There have been a couple of screwups with the Razor/Jake, T-Bone/Chance thing. The first is in "Wrath of DarkKat", where the guys are in the Hangar working on the TurboKat dressed in the flight-suits, and Razor addresses T-Bone as "Chance". There's no one else present, but he doesn't usually do this, probably because he doesn't want to get into any bad habits. In the "Giant Cicada" (don't have the correct title in front of me), he calls T-Bone "Chance" again, and I think he had someone watching that time - but it was scrambled so I couldn't make it out. Andy (...this is one of the more prolific newsgroups now, and it isn't one!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:42:43 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08830 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:42:42 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:47:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504251529.aa04565@polar.pica.army.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Ed Rudnicki wrote: > Is it me, or do too many Enforcers successfully bail out of their > helos? I know I've seen a few instances where they seem to go down > with their aircraft, which is realistic, but there are some where > they successfully get out, which is unlikely. The second season eps show a lot less "hitting the silk". I have a friend that flies Bell 212's (civvy "Twin Huey") and the general rule about bailing out of choppers seems to be: "You auto-rotate, or you die." Think about it. You're in a BlackHawk that's crashing, and you jump out. Are you going to clear the rotor? Don't think so. P.S. The radio interference to the fly-by-wire controls in my fanfic-thing was based on a number of BlackHawk helicopter crashes apparently caused by control system failure brought on by exposure to a heavy electromagnetic field. There have been six instances so far, if I recall, but everyone's been reluctant to pinpoint that as the cause. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:45:30 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08848 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:45:29 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:50:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504251606.aa04673@polar.pica.army.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Ed Rudnicki wrote: > There are apparently several different April O'Neil figures, from > what I've read on rec.toys.misc. I've got two versions. They differ only minorly. > I don't know that a Callie figure would sell by itself in that > manner, though :) Heh. Ask this one on alt.fan.furry, and I think you'd change your mind! . She's not on the current production list of toys. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:49:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08871 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:49:31 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:54:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Where to find Kats in New York.... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504271027.aa08778@polar.pica.army.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > I beg to differ, after what he did to "Heavy Metal". As to the time > being ungodly, don't you use a VCR? I don't think I've ever seen a Ted Turner has no friends here, and none at Hanna-Barbera. 'Nuff said. > Ed > Who _still_ doesn't know why he likes SK so much :) Easy answer, you have good taste like the rest of us. (and good taste in quotes, I might add.) Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 10:56:27 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id KAA08925 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 10:56:27 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 07:31:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Violence? A 5% gratuity is considered polite... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <95Apr27.054105edt.46118@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > Andy Hill: > > Yes. Exactly. Too many cartoons etc teaching people to be McSheep, > > and we all know what happens to sheep. > > umm, they die? don't wolves die too? :) Heh. Yep, wolves die too, but they die with some honour. Sheep just die. The difference is more noticeable to some than others. I won't stray too far from the path here, but T-Bone and Razor see something wrong, and fix it. Simple. (Aaah! Ross Perot imitation!). I tend to do that too (I get lots of black eyes breaking up fights). Over-government is a pet peeve, but essentially it boils down to this: T-Bone and Razor didn't follow Feral's stupid order to break off the pursuit of DarkKat, because they recognized the order for what it was - stupid - and they knew better. They didn't just turn off their brains because someone was telling them what's good for them. They thought independently, came up with a viable alternative they knew was right, and pursued it being fully aware of the possible consequences, and accepted them when they occurred. The "McSheep" thing I had in mind, specifically, is some of the 'toons out there that hit you over the head with the message to do the Orwellian thing and "obey" this, that and the other without giving it a second thought. The extension of this is that simply because people see something given as a "moral" at the end of a cartoon, they accept it as a fact simply because they assume whoever got it on the air is smarter and more well-equipped to think than themselves. Question to illustrate: the media and the Government have a major impact on how most citizenry thinks - Razor and T-Bone are undeniably a force for good, but do they listen to everything the "authorities" say without questioning? No. This is what will keep them out of the long lines for the gas-chamber the next time Nazis roll around, can't say the same for the McSheep. Andy (gotta stop these novelized responses to one-sentence posts..) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 11:59:40 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id LAA09335 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 11:59:39 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 11:59:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Bad vehicle, list and lab day... In-Reply-To: <9504270636.AA05089@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 26 Apr 1995, Dana Uehara wrote: > In any event, I received a couple of bounces that never made it through to > the list, but I'll resend them. One is Andy's comment about "the second > season showing less chutes than the first," and another is Tim Fay's > announcement about KATATONIC, the _Kats_ fanzine. Majordomo is setup to look for words like "unsubscribe" and so on. I've had it bounce a few messages of mine, so I've disabled that feature. Let's see if we get any more bounced messages. > Paul: I accidently deleted all the mailing lists. > > Even if the last backup was last week, or the week prior, I don't think > more than a handful of listers were lost. Hopefully those people who were > dropped will realize the sudden decline in listmail (from prolific to zero) > and will query me and/or rejoin the list. That's good news. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 12:04:16 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA09401 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:04:16 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:04:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: who knows the Kats? In-Reply-To: <95Apr27.052843edt.46115@colossus.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Felix Lee wrote: > so if Feral knows or suspects who the Kats are, then how about Callie? Speaking of that, did they ever have an episode where they showed the Kat guys giving Callie that beeper? And does Callie know who they really are? I've never seen evidence that she does, but I've never seen her say she didn't. I hope they keep it running in repeats for awhile. There's a bunch I havn't seen I'm sure of it. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 12:09:04 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA09446 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:09:04 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:09:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... In-Reply-To: <9504251529.aa04565@polar.pica.army.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 25 Apr 1995, Ed Rudnicki wrote: > >> the Enforcers seem as likely to do civilian casualties as the Kats. > > > > Heh! The Enforcers are more than likely to cause the civilian > >casualties, if from nothing else than injuries received by the populace > >when the daily quota of choppers falls out of the sky. > > Is it me, or do too many Enforcers successfully bail out of their > helos? I know I've seen a few instances where they seem to go down > with their aircraft, which is realistic, but there are some where > they successfully get out, which is unlikely. Or Feral always goes down with his "chopper backup", and yet always survives. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 12:44:03 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA09616 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:44:03 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f9fc9ae1ccf002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Thu, 27 Apr 95 11:43:26 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: KATATONIC! Content-Length: 34 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Thanks for re-posting this, Dana! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 12:48:14 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id MAA09640 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 12:48:14 -0400 From: fayxx001@maroon.tc.umn.edu Message-Id: <2f9fcab3232b002@maroon.tc.umn.edu> Date: Thu, 27 Apr 95 11:47:47 -0500 To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Where to find Kats in New York.... Content-Length: 178 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >From: Ed Rudnicki >I beg to differ, after what he did to "Heavy Metal". I doubt he could have made that movie any worse than it already is. 1/2 :-) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 19:06:16 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA15768 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 19:06:03 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 95 19:08:04 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... Message-ID: <9504271908.aa10794@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: >> Is it me, or do too many Enforcers successfully bail out of their >> helos? I know I've seen a few instances where they seem to go down >> with their aircraft, which is realistic, but there are some where >> they successfully get out, which is unlikely. > > The second season eps show a lot less "hitting the silk". I have a >friend that flies Bell 212's (civvy "Twin Huey") and the general rule >about bailing out of choppers seems to be: > > "You auto-rotate, or you die." > > Think about it. You're in a BlackHawk that's crashing, and you jump >out. Are you going to clear the rotor? Don't think so. Well, the Russian Kamov Ka-50 Werewolf ("Airwolf, meet Werewolf" :) has an ejection seat, and a means to detach the rotors for it, but for other helos your friend is right. It seems most of the Enforcer helos getting downed are going down in flames. There should be no survivors. Not nice, but conflict seldom is. Ed Rudnicki erudnick@pica.army.mil TLM addict FDC Bronx FDC Night Watchman "You're getting brutal, Sark - brutal, and needlessly cruel." "Thank you, Master Cee!" --- (Tron) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 19:10:28 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA15821 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 19:10:28 -0400 From: flogistn@netaxs.com Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 18:55:49 -0400 Message-Id: <199504272255.SAA15679@unix1.netaxs.com> To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Signal-to-noise ratio Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: The signal-to-noise ratio on this mailing list is getting a little high lately -- single-line postings with rather limited scope. May I humbly request that responses to a single user not be posted to the whole group? (dreading a slew of posted replies that all say, "Yeah, what he said!") ----- Samuel Conway, Ph.D. Senior etc. etc. Avid Therapeutics Philadelphia, PA flogistn@netaxs.com From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 19:12:04 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id TAA15838 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 19:12:03 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504272311.AA06945@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: Really Obscure Reference. To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 18:11:07 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: <9504251529.aa04565@polar.pica.army.mil> from "Ed Rudnicki" at Apr 25, 95 03:29:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 422 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Just a quick question. During the whole "How Cartoons Are Made" bit, a scene from a SWAT Kats episode is seen on a projected screen and a voice actress (Is that Tress?) is busy saying something. My tape with all the first season episodes is at home, and I don't recognize that scene (Kinda hard to make out too.). What's it from? I'm just curious. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 21:36:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA16339 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 21:36:55 -0400 From: MATT_W@delphi.com Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 21:36:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUJU4F5YA9AP2CS@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 24 Apr 1995 Andy Hill wrote: > Despite all the monster-battles, cool drawings, music and >action - know what I like about the KAT guys most? Scenes like >the "Chili-Pepper Eating Competition", and the one where they're >trying to outdo eachother in the centrifuge. Nobody writes >character stuff like that anymore, and these are the scenes that >stick, and are usually the ones I show to You know, I think it would really be great if there were an episode in which there is no *major* villian reaking havoc all over the city. Just a show focusing on the personal lives of all the characters including Callie, Feral, etc. It probably wouldn't go over very big with the suits claiming "no action = no show = no money". I think one of my favorite scenes is the one in which Chance & Jake are working on Callie's car giving it a tune-up. Callie is saying "good-bye" to go off with the mayor and Chance thinks she likes him until she steps back to give a more "loving" good-bye & wave to Jake. -Matt From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 21:44:37 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA16382 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 21:44:36 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 18:49:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: who knows the Kats? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Ratman wrote: > I hope they keep it running in repeats for awhile. There's a bunch I > havn't seen I'm sure of it. Yeah, me too. If it weren't for people who taped/shipped them for me, I wouldn't have seen ANY second season eps. I haven't called them to confirm, but TBS has them scheduled through the end of July only. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 21:46:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA16411 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 21:46:14 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 18:51:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Ratman wrote: > Or Feral always goes down with his "chopper backup", and yet always survives. And has successfully crashed into Manx's office twice - with the same results - each time displacing Manx's golf clubs! Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 21:49:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA16438 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 21:49:31 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504280148.AA14434@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: To Everyone... To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 20:48:35 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: <01HPUJU4F5YA9AP2CS@delphi.com> from "MATT_W@delphi.com" at Apr 27, 95 09:36:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 244 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Folks, I'm going to go home on May 12th and will be off the net for 14 whole weeks. I'd like the snail mail address of everybody. Please E-Mail them to me and thanks. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 22:27:44 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA16636 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 22:27:43 -0400 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 22:27:32 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Swat Kats Love To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I wonder who could fall in love with the Swat Kats? This is something that's been bothering me since they cancelled it. I know that relationships on Cartoon shows are bad. But when i saw Callie Briggs for the first time i went crazy and thought "How could the writers not see that? But then again i could just as well be ignorrant. Matmilam From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Thu Apr 27 22:31:45 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA16685 for kats-ll; Thu, 27 Apr 1995 22:31:44 -0400 From: MATT_W@delphi.com Date: Thu, 27 Apr 1995 22:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: GIF of T-Bone To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPULR8DYIW93CKD9@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Hi! Incidentally, the GIF was scanned and extensively cleaned up by me. Please ignore the email address at AOL, I'm just using up some free time. Please send any comments to: matt_w@delphi.com Thanks! From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 02:36:15 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA17588 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:36:09 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:36:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Complex is hard in 22 mins, but 44? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUU783ULU93CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Thats for sure. You need at least 10 minutes of building up the plot before you let loose with the action scenes. Speaking of scenes, if anyone wants digitized pics from the show let me know cause I got quite a few of them and eventually I'll be doing more. These are in JPEG format. If you want em then give me your private email address so I can UUENCODE em for ya. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 02:40:46 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA17610 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:40:45 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:40:42 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUUCD2Q6W93CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: First of all Feral has to catch Razor and T-Bone which is not going to be easy to do. Besides, if they were caught Callie Briggs will defend them herself. Come to think of it, if Feral is really smart he would not get Callie Briggs upset. She is definitly one lady that you don't want to upset if you value your life. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 02:54:38 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id CAA17636 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:54:37 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 02:54:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Does Feral know? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUUIMIAAM93CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: As for Feral knowing who Razor and T-Bone are I doubt it cause if he did he would have grounded them a long time ago. If you remember the story on how Jake and Chance became the Swat Kats due to Feral's mistake. Well, Feral grounded them perminantly until they paid for the damage to the Enforcer building that Feral created. Because of this Feral would ground them no matter what cause Feral appears to be the kind of kat that takes orders and if anybody goes over his head it really ticks him off. Take this into consideration as well, do we know if Feral knows Jake's skills as an inventor? I don't think so cause if the Enforcers are anything like the Air Force or the Army then they will have the mechanics fix the equipment and not the pilots or the gunners working on their own planes. As for the Feral's phrase "Hot Shots" it could be one of his favorite phrases cause he used it a couple of times with Felina doing outrageous things like Razor and T-Bone. The only thing that could give them away are Jake's and Chance's voices. If Feral knew their voices well which I'm sure he did then he would know who they are. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 03:03:13 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA17665 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:03:13 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:03:09 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Kat weaponry, revisited... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUV1366B893CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: The reason why its Razor's favorite missile is he has a thing for the classic weapons. In fact Razor stated it in one of the earlier eps. He said, "With all the different high-tech weapons that we have I love the plain old missle the best." Or something like that. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 03:14:20 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA17691 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:14:19 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:14:15 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: "A Deadly Pyramid" -- how deadly? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUVEJXVRE93CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Speaking of the 70's, don't forget Johnny Quest. This is the show that Race Bannon is either in a dog fight with out his guns as he does and impossible manuver to trick the bad guy in which the bad guy goes flying into the side of the mountain. Then there was another incident where we see Race Bannon shooting some bad guys out of the tree and we see them falling out of the tree. This was one hellava olent cartoon and it was one hellava cartoon with great action and annimation for that time. I agree that they are worring over nothing. I think the reason why they are saying this is that they have waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much time on their hands so they have to do or find some other forms of activities. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 03:25:21 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id DAA17741 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:25:20 -0400 From: WKOZIOL@delphi.com Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 03:25:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stuph, morbid and non-morbid... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPUVYJA4S093CPME@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I think I know how they do it. They use stunt doubles in the chopper scenes cause I guess they are more expendable. From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 20:17:43 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA21874 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 20:17:25 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 95 20:12:13 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: To Everyone... Message-ID: <9504282012.aa13571@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > Folks, I'm going to go home on May 12th and will be off the net for 14 >whole weeks. I'd like the snail mail address of everybody. Please E-Mail them >to me and thanks. In case you _really_ meant _everybody_: Ed Rudnicki P.O. Box N Wharton, NJ 07885 From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 20:37:28 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA21924 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 20:37:27 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 95 20:39:48 EDT From: Ed Rudnicki To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: To Everyone... Message-ID: <9504282039.aa13674@polar.pica.army.mil> Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Sorry about the last message. I didn't mean to reply to the whole group. Sorry sorry sorry! I guess I make Feral look smart now, don't I? Ed From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 22:19:41 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA22124 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 22:19:39 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 19:25:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "You can take this job and shov...." To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Heh. Somethings just make your day! Before I get into the story, some folks have asked questions that I may as well answer just the once to the group. Ted Turner owns Turner Program Services, which in turn owns outright: CNN, TBS(and many affiliates), The Cartoon Network, the MGM film library, a bunch of cable stations, and Hanna-Barbera. Hanna-Barbera used to be an independent entity run by William Hanna and Joseph Barbera until they retired, and the organization was purchased by Ted. Since then, nothing occurs at H-B without the approval of something like eleven different levels of the Turner chain of command, all the way up to Ted himself, despite the fact that either Joe or Bill still work there. Cancellation of "SwatKats" is NOT THE FAULT OF HANNA-BARBERA - it's the marketing suits at Turner who are to blame. For those of us that already knew this, I'm sure we've wanted to say a few choice words to Turner's blue-suits. Someone did. Some of us know that after production was ordered halted, a number of the production people who believed in the show kept badgering Turner Group to grow some brains cells before it was evidently made clear that they either shut up or get out. After the order to stop in the middle of ep 11 of the second season, a meeting was held behind closed doors, at which were present Davis Doi, Victoria McCollum, Fred Seibert, Lance Falk, Glenn Leopold, and a number of blue-suites from TPS. The purpose of the meeting was to announce immediate layoffs because "they weren't making enough money". The production people looked at each other, and Lance Falk, knowing he was history, stood up and said: "Why don't you fire the marketing people? We DID our jobs..." and pointed to the TPS reps across the table from him. You see, when a show like SwatKats is put on the air, the industry standard is that you have the marketing/licensing/toy deals in place before the first episode is shown. Nobody will buy the property if those aren't in place. Turner Group "is still learning the business" and felt they knew better than everyone else, so the marketing suits simply ignored the ratings, and pursued the marketing end of things just enough to fulfill the contracts in place. The toys were scheduled to come out in Fall 94, but the manufacturer, Remco, wasn't "getting any support from Turner", and decided that bringing out the toys in December of that year and pitting them against the MMPR powerhouse wasn't going to be a great idea if Turner wasn't prepared to do the advertising. He wasn't. Falk's statement reflects the fact that H-B made an incredible product, got the top slot in the ratings - so what more could they have done? Many people don't know that all the money to be made from a show like SwatKats comes from the toys, games, t-shirts etc that people buy, not the simple fact that you watch it, and the ads that come with it. This is the most basic rule of marketing a show, but Turner didn't know it, and fired much of the creative team instead of the marketing idiots who were not only incompetent, but essentially sabotaged the show. (Sorry if the above is really basic for you cartoon-literate folks, I wasn't sure of the makeup of the audience.) The upcoming Animato! article has finally got the green light from Hanna-Barbera, once they realized it was strictly about the show and didn't take a bite out of Turner's hide. I have a letter going out to the producer of SwatKats, Davis Doi, who did much to save the show at the peril of his own position, explaining that most of us realize it wasn't the fault of the creative team - and that the blame rests squarely with his bosses. Last thing, someone asked about H-B's "Nexus" project. Today's word is that it won't be pursued because someone suddenly realized "just how violent the property was". Sound familiar? Andy _________________________________________________________________________ "His biography said he bumped his butt 'cuz he ate too much sugar... ....it's SAD (really)..." - Slappy Squirrel, "Bumbie's Mom" ANIMX _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 22:29:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA22218 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 22:29:55 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 19:35:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPUJU4F5YA9AP2CS@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995 MATT_W@delphi.com wrote: > You know, I think it would really be great if there were an > episode in which there is no *major* villian reaking havoc > all over the city. Just a show focusing on the personal > lives of all the characters including Callie, Feral, etc. > It probably wouldn't go over very big with the suits claiming > "no action = no show = no money". This is changing a bit in the industry. "Exo" got shut down after two seasons, and it had plenty of "action" and "money". SwatKats killed it in the ratings adjusted for broadcast area. > I think one of my favorite scenes is the one in which Chance & > Jake are working on Callie's car giving it a tune-up. Callie > is saying "good-bye" to go off with the mayor and Chance > thinks she likes him until she steps back to give a more > "loving" good-bye & wave to Jake. I caught that. I like the way T-Bone slicks his hair back, and starts doing the macho routine, leaving poor Jake to do all the work, but Callie seems to like Jake more anyway. Heh. Too bad life doesn't work out that way, huh? T-Bone's always showing off in front of the girls. Reference "Pastmaster Always Rings Twice", when he's on the museum roof with Razor, and he says "Can I give you ladies a hand?", and lifts both Callie and Dr. Sinian to safety. Then when the nasty cat is about to attack, he bares his teeth and claws ready to show off yet again in a single-handed cat vs. cat battle, until Razor robs him of his macho display with one round from the cement machine gun. Poor T-Bone, no luck with the chicks. I can't think of any instance aside from the one Matt mentioned where any of the show's female characters express a preference for one of the other 'KAT guys - can anyone else? Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 22:40:24 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA22292 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 22:40:22 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 19:45:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Swat Kats Love To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 27 Apr 1995, Matthew b Milam wrote: > I wonder who could fall in love with the Swat Kats? > > This is something that's been bothering me since they cancelled it. I > know that relationships on Cartoon shows are bad. But when i saw Callie > Briggs for the first time i went crazy and thought "How could the writers > not see that? > > But then again i could just as well be ignorrant. This is sort of an extension of the other post, but what the heck. Assuming Callie and Felina are the only two eligible females, I'd be tempted to pair T-Bone and Felina, and Razor with Callie. Felina strikes me as the Amazon/Klingon type, very physical, as is T-Bone usually - but still has another side you don't normally catch a glimpse of, also like T-Bone. Callie and Razor are both more, well..."intellectual" (not a negative reflection on T-Bone, BTW) and would have more in common with each other than any other possible match-up. I get the idea that the Jake character is kind of shy, but he's obviously interested as demonstrated in "Chaos in Crystal": "Who cares? We've got some chicks to pick up" (or similar) Callie's written in there for all the .fandom people - she's quite a babe for a splotch of ink and paint, though she doesn't have much to do with the story, usually. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 22:46:54 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id WAA22318 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 22:46:52 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 19:52:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "Miss Briggs, you're out of order..." To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <01HPUUCD2Q6W93CPME@delphi.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 28 Apr 1995 WKOZIOL@delphi.com wrote: > First of all Feral has to catch Razor and T-Bone which is not going to be > easy to do. Besides, if they were caught Callie Briggs will defend them > herself. Come to think of it, if Feral is really smart he would not get > Callie Briggs upset. She is definitly one lady that you don't want to upset > if you value your life. Ummm...Feral's had tons of Enforcers surrounding T-Bone and Razor on a number of occasions, if he wanted to do it, it wouldn't be hard - remember, all the Enforcers that would be taking Feral's orders believe that the 'KATS are a menace after hearing it so often from Feral. I doubt they would _all_ feel that way, though. What would Callie do in case the SwatKats ended up in the nick? A similar scenario to "Evil Side of the SwatKats", perhaps? The more I hear variations of this idea, the more I think it'd make a fine story. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 23:42:49 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA22448 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 23:42:48 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 23:42:38 +0059 (EDT) From: Matthew b Milam Subject: Re: "You can take this job and shov...." To: Andy Hill Cc: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: How can i get animato? Matmilam From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Fri Apr 28 23:54:46 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id XAA22473 for kats-ll; Fri, 28 Apr 1995 23:54:44 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504290353.AA93327@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: New Technology! To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 22:53:47 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "Matthew b Milam" at Apr 27, 95 10:27:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 5552 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I once came up with a whole bunch of new technology for the show and I figured I'd share it with everybody. It's possible that something similiar to any of these has been shown in one of the second season episodes that I haven't seen, and if that's the case, let me know. Anyway, here they are: Melter Missles: These missles are loaded with a corrosive acid. They explode on contact and spray it all over the intended target, or they can be set to inject the target with the acid as if they were giant hypodermics. The SwatKruise: This is a cruise missle (Ahem, "Kruise" missle that is.) that can fly and manuver independently of the TurboKat. It flies according to its artificial intelligence program on preprogrammed missions, or under the control of Razor through virtual presence technology. It carries a gun and some mini missles of it's own. That way it can act as a doppleganger ship (Like in Gradius and other shoot-em-ups) if the TurboKat is busy elsewhere. If need be, it can act as a regular missle (though that would be a bit of a waste of it's technology), only fly much further and explode with more force. Lazer Missles: Like the name says, this fires a high intensity lazer in brief bursts. It's great for cutting through stuff, or firing at numerous rapidly moving targets. I'm not so certain what to call the next missle. I'm not even certain of how it works. There may be many different versions of it. Anyhow, the missle would fly to its target, decelerate, and then stick to it. It would detonate after a set time or when Razor pushes a button. It may use some find of fast working superglue, a suction cup, or magnets to do this, but I can't decide which. It might be best to have one version of each like I suggested, but I'm just not certain at this point. I don't know what it would be called, or if the different versions should have different names, so feel free to suggest names for it/them. Freeze Missles: Filled with supercooled liquid, these missles chill their targets to cryogenic temperatures (kinda like negative napalm). Most monster would be killed, machinery would cease to operate, and everything would become as brittle as glass. Upon the introduction of it, there should be a line of dialog about how the SWAT Kats got the idea from the LOX (Liquid Oxygen) tank in "Destructive Nature". And here's some technological improvements for the TurboKat: Mission Adaptive Wing (MAW): I've noticed that the TurboKat has fairly standard rectangular wing flaps that pivot at one point. These are increasingly outdated. MAW's emulate the streamlined contuors of a bird's wings by having the leading edge, trailing edge, or perhaps the entire length of the wing flex according to flight control algorithims. Test have already been conducted on experimental versions of the F-111, and results have been positive. Manuverability is increased as is smoothness of flight and efficiency. Since this is what fighter aircraft will have in the 21st century, the TurboKat should have MAW's as well. Canards: Front wheel steering is used on cars becaue it much easier to control where the vehicle is headed rather than try and turn it from where it's been. As similiar thing applies to aircraft. Canards, small horizontal control surfaces placed ahead of the wings, are featured on high tech jets such as the B-1, X-29, and YF-22. It might be a good idea to include some type of canards on the nose of the TurboKat in addition to keeping the horizontal/vertical stabilizers located toward the rear. This would greatly increase manuverability and might allow for cushioning of bumpy air. If the TurboKat is the size I think it is, then canards should be trapezoids about one foot wide by two and a half feet long and just in front of and under the cockpit. In addition to the stealth technology I once mentioned earlier, I've tossed around the idea of the TurboKat having some type of engine noise suppression system (Possibly an antinoise device.), but that wouldn't be such a great thing (Who wants a quiet TurboKat - Yeeeach!). Maybe the SWAT Kats *do* have one, but they just don't use it because, like Razor said when describing the Banshee Missles: "They sound cool." The Cement Machine Gun is great, but it really hangs out and probably causes a lot of drag. For that reason, there should be a way for it to fire through some holes while still not deployed. True, it's targeting abilities would be greatly hampered, but it would be good to use during dogfights. The holes would be in the side of the nosecone (looking like ovals from the side and circles from head on.), and lead right to the barrel of the gun. When not in use, panels would be in place to cover the holes. The holes would be wider than the barrel to allow some very minor targeting, and to prevent cement from gumming up the interior (Most cement slugs would paas right on through without touching the side of the hole.). To further prevent clogging, the interiors would be coated with teflon. When the time came to use the point the Cement Machine Gun in a direction the TurboKat wasn't directly facing, it would be deployed as always. That's all that I had written at the time. I may come up with more stuff later, but until then, don't hesitate to make comments, suggestions, ideas of your own, or whatever. We may just come up with an whole arsenal of new technology. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 00:05:31 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA22591 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:05:30 -0400 Message-Id: <9504290405.AA29719@cisk> Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net () Date: Fri, 28 Apr 95 21:05:17 PDT In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 28, 95 07:35:25 pm From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 967 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill writes: > Poor T-Bone has no luck with the chicks. I can't think of any > instance aside from the one Matt mentioned where any of the show's > female characters express a preference for one of the other 'KAT guys > - can anyone else? Heh. _Toon Magazine_ gives Chance/T-Bone's profile as a Kat who "fancies himself a ladies' man, but who generally has more success as a maniac in the [skies.]" As far as female characters expressing a preference, well -- you've got the one-shots (Turmoil really liking T-Bone [and the feeling being mutual?] and Queen Callista taking a liking to Razor, but eventually recognizing T-Bone as part of the team too). And I'd say that Callie likes Jake better than she does Chance (course, this is probably biased since I roleplay Jake/Razor on the MUCKs ;-). -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 00:19:00 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA22671 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:18:59 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504290418.AA49422@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: How is SWAT Kats spelled? To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 23:18:03 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: <9504290353.AA93327@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> from "Kevin L. Knoles" at Apr 28, 95 10:53:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 937 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I'm just wondering, how is SWAT Kats spelled? I don't mean that it's S-W-A-T-space-K-A-T-S, I obviously know that already. I just want to know if there is an official version. I used to spell it Swatkats, SwatKats, SWATKATS, SWATKats, and the two word versions of the first three, but now I spell it SWAT Kats since that's what the "SWAT Kats Radical Riders Bike Safety Checklist" had listed. That version doesn't really look perfect since it would appear as if SWAT is a prefix in the same manner as it is for police SWAT, but the show doesn't really support this (Police are usually not fighter pilots.). How is it listed in different articles? Has the name ever appeared on the show outside of the opening and credits? Not that I'm hugely concerned about the whole thing, just curious. It's the question that was bound to be asked sooner or later. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 00:26:08 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA22727 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:26:07 -0400 Date: Fri, 28 Apr 1995 21:31:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: "Goodnite, my Queen...C'mon buddy, I've got a hot forge..." To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: <9504290405.AA29719@cisk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Razor sky-writes: > As far as female characters expressing a preference, well -- you've got > the one-shots (Turmoil really liking T-Bone [and the feeling being mutual?] > and Queen Callista taking a liking to Razor, but eventually recognizing > T-Bone as part of the team too). And I'd say that Callie likes Jake > better than she does Chance (course, this is probably biased since I > roleplay Jake/Razor on the MUCKs ;-). T-Bone and I have similar luck, but I don't do "macho". Anyway, I have mixed feelings about "Bride of the Pastmaster". Some of the dialogue in there is great, and some of it is really bad (IMO). All the Razor/T-Bone stuff is great ("T-Bone and Razor...Razor and T-Bone...") but some of Razor's dialogue with/regarding Callista is quite corny. "Goodnite my Queen" is likely to be intended that way, because T-Bone makes fun of the way it sounds with: "..'goodnite My Queen'...c'mon buddy, I've got a hot forge for ya to meet..." (close enough). They were sure flirting with each-other when she stays to "dine with Sir Razor", and you'll notice later on when she asks him if "Hangar" is the name of his city, that Razor's eyes change to "hearts" for a frame or two. Heh! Poor T-Bone never got so much as a whiff of "pepper stew", and probably nearly died of thirst as well - I didn't see the goblet holding a "mega-size quantity of milk" for him. The scene at the end where Callista heaps praise on Razor and kisses him - where T-Bone shakes his head in amazement - was perfect, lucky he ended up with a kiss himself, or I would've been mad. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 00:37:56 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA22804 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:37:56 -0400 From: MATT_W@delphi.com Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:37:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Does Feral know? To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPW4GWV36099KUNJ@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: WKOZIOL@delphi.com writes: >Felina doing outrageous things like Razor and T-Bone. The only >thing that could give them away are Jake's and Chance's voices. >If Feral knew their voices well which I'm sure he did then he >would know who they are. I'm not so sure about that. Jake & Chance had only been on the enforcer squadron for a short time (if I remember that episode correctly). Feral may not have been with them long enough to be able to recognize their voices as being those of TBone & Razor. -Matt From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 00:47:59 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id AAA22841 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:47:59 -0400 From: MATT_W@delphi.com Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 00:47:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Stereotyped, monotyped, poorly typed. To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-id: <01HPW4TE64F299KUNJ@delphi.com> X-VMS-To: IN%"kats@sard.mv.net" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Andy Hill writes: >with the chicks. I can't think of any instance aside from the one >Matt mentioned where any of the show's female characters express a >preference for one of the other 'KAT guys - can anyone else? I can't remember for sure, but wasn't there something sort of along these lines at the end of "Crystal Chaos" when TB & R are going to pick up the stranded Anne Gora & Callie on their floating helocopter? Hmmm.. I'm gonna have to take another look at that one. -Matt From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 14:50:09 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id OAA24721 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 14:50:06 -0400 Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 11:55:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Christian Tremblay says Hello... To: kats@sard.mv.net Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: I just got off the phone with Christian Tremblay (1130 hrs PST) and he wanted me to tell everyone on this group that him and his brother really appreciate that people support the show like this, and if he had his way he'd "send everyone a cell or something" but he's doing two other projects and fighting for this one, there isn't time! They're going to get a computer, and I'll tell them how to get on the list once they do. News-type stuff. First of all, "Dr. Konway" - Christian remembered you and the story behind the "Mutation City" ep without any prompting - he's glad that "the old fat scientist is still very much a fan". Their relations with Hanna-Barbera are so bad at the moment, that Fred Seibert - the president - isn't returning his calls. Christian says it's not a problem, if he really wants to get hold of Fred, he calls about ten times a day until he's made so much of a nuisance of himself that Fred calls back! Hanna-Barbera is evidently carrying on some huge construction project for "offices" - a strange thing for an organization that's "not making money" to do. Toys. August 1st is the official release date for the toys, but we don't know the time-frame for each individual Toys 'R' Us and Target to get them. Production run will start mid-May. Video game. The Hudson Soft SNES game had the colours designed by Christain, and he's still waiting for a sample, although it's scheduled for a July 1st release to stores. It's supposed to be pretty cool. Home Videos. There will be three cassettes, scheduled for a July 5th release. Each cassette has different cover art, and has a different theme: Cassette 1: Dr. Viper a) The Giant Bacteria b) Destructive Nature Cassette 2: Dark Kat a) Nite of the Dark Kat b) The Wrath of Dark Kat Cassette 3: The Metallikats a) The Metallikats b) Metal Urgency Each cassette has a fifteen second trailer attached to the front for the SNES video game, and a 5 buck rebate coupon. I'm sending him printouts from this group and r.a.a. - if you wish your stuff excluded for whatever reason, could you please let me know and I'll delete it from the package. If you have anything you want to send to them, could you e-mail it to me, and I'll include it. They really like hearing from the fans. Christian has been trying to get interest from Hollywood in the "SwatKats" movie - either feature animation, live action (like TMNT I) or Direct-to-video, but everyone in Hollywood is waiting to see how the marketing of the toys etc. do before committing to anything. Here's the sad part. Someone in Hollywierd has given the green-light to produce a live-action "Biker Mice" flick, but doesn't think the 'KAT guys have a chance? Give your head a shake, people. Andy From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 18:07:22 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id SAA25347 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 18:07:21 -0400 From: klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Kevin L. Knoles) Message-Id: <9504292206.AA24204@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Subject: Live Action SWAT Kats? To: kats@sard.mv.net Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 17:06:25 -0500 (CDT) In-Reply-To: from "Andy Hill" at Apr 29, 95 11:55:55 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1090 Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: > like hearing from the fans. Christian has been trying to get interest > from Hollywood in the "SwatKats" movie - either feature animation, live > action (like TMNT I) or Direct-to-video, but everyone in Hollywood is > waiting to see how the marketing of the toys etc. do before committing to > > Andy > > A live action SWAT Kats movie? Others may disagree, but I say *NO Way!!* True, such a thing may do wonders for the show and toyline, and it would likely spawn a comic book, trading cards, and other things, but I just can't accept the notion of a live action SWAT Kats movie. The big suits of T-Bone and Razor that actors dressed in for comic conventions is something I'll accept, but nothing further than that. I hate this notion that Hollywood has that live action is somehow better than animation. It's not and what you see on your TV's proves it. I just get nausceous thinking about it. Live action SWAT Kats? Bleeeeech! Sorry to whine and complain, Andy. That just really pressed a button. Kevin L. Knoles klknole@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 20:57:02 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA25801 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 20:56:54 -0400 Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 20:56:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Re: Live Action SWAT Kats? In-Reply-To: <9504292206.AA24204@rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 29 Apr 1995, Kevin L. Knoles wrote: > proves it. I just get nausceous thinking about it. Live action SWAT Kats? > Bleeeeech! I agree. I'd much prefer an animated version. But lots of frames per second, great sound quality, etc... Movie quality. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Work: paul@mv.mv.com | Play: rat@rat.mv.com WWW : http://www.mv.com/users/rat | FTP : ftp://ftp.mv.com/pub/users/rat AOL : PaulHurley | CIS : 75014,77 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sat Apr 29 21:21:30 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA26063 for kats-ll; Sat, 29 Apr 1995 21:21:29 -0400 Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 18:27:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Live Action SWAT Kats? To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 29 Apr 1995, Ratman wrote: > On Sat, 29 Apr 1995, Kevin L. Knoles wrote: > > > proves it. I just get nausceous thinking about it. Live action SWAT Kats? > > Bleeeeech! > > I agree. I'd much prefer an animated version. But lots of frames per second, > great sound quality, etc... Movie quality. Personally, I would rather see the animated movie - really well done of course, and I know I'll get flamed, but I'd like to see it done in the style of Mook from "Unlikely Alloys". Some people really hate that kind of angular style, but I really liked it, despite the fact some of the facial expressions were a bit rigid, T-Bone and Razor looked so, well, I dunno - "cool". Live action? Hmmm. I thought the first TMNT movie worked well with the Animatronics from Henson, and I'll disagree with you lot and say that it could work if lots of money was spent. T-Bone and Razor would end up looking quite good, I think, but the ancilliary characters like Callie would be hard to get "right". I think this really depends on whether or not you liked the first TMNT movie - Christian brought it up, though I was already thinking about it. The TurboKat stuff would be _very_ hard to do, granted, and MegaKat City would be very hard to create in order to maintain the same "feel" from the cartoon. A live action flick could preserve the nature of the characters, which is what I like most out of the whole show anyhow - but I think the animated route should be first. Andy (Kevin, don't need to apologize to me...I know people who hated TMNT 1 and love the Turtles!) From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 30 20:30:32 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id UAA01233 for kats-ll; Sun, 30 Apr 1995 20:30:15 -0400 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 1995 20:30:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Ratman To: kats@sard.mv.net Subject: Kat stuff Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: stupid majordomo won't let messages go though with the word "subscrib e". Of course I didn't write it, or it would have bounced this message. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 30 Apr 95 14:15:00 PDT From: duehara@cisk.atmos.Ucla.EDU (Dana Uehara) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] content-length: 1303 A few comments: First off, the list has been fairly prolific lately and at least two people have told me they're planning to un-subscribe from the list because of its volume. I'm thinking of creating a digest, but unfortunately I don't know how the Majordomo software works for digest creations. (If necessary, I'll create the digests manually and send them out to individual people who want to keep up with the Kats, but don't have time to keep up with the mailing list.) Second, the signal-to-noise ratio. The only comment I'll make about that is that if you can isolate people who are quoting entire messages and including only one or two lines of included text, then email them directly. Don't drag it onto the list, please. (And yes, I'll be following this rule as much as possible.) Third, the live-action Kats movie. I'd personally prefer an animated version myself, and I'd like to see Mook do the work on it. Has Christian Tremblay worked out a particular story idea for the movie? Fourth, I caught a cold a few days ago and still have a residual sore throat, so if I start chewing out anyone I probably don't mean it. -- =================== Dana Uehara (duehara@atmos.ucla.edu) ================== "Hey, what took ya?" "Didja have to kick me so *hard*?!" -- T-Bone & Razor From owner-kats@sard.mv.net Sun Apr 30 21:27:36 1995 Received: by sard.mv.net (8.6.9/mv(b)/mem-941101) id VAA01387 for kats-ll; Sun, 30 Apr 1995 21:27:34 -0400 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 1995 18:34:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Andy Hill Subject: Re: Kat stuff To: kats@sard.mv.net In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-kats@sard.mv.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: kats@sard.mv.net Status: O X-Status: Okay, part of the prolific thing is my fault, it's a bad usenet habit I picked up from newsgroups. I'll shut up unless I have something to report from H-B or similar. Two people have already unsubscribed, I know of a third who will - I won't be part of the problem. Idea for movie script? He didn't mention any, but I would assume it depends on whether they go live-ac or animation. I'll find out. _________________________________________________________________________ "We have a mission Ann, down these mean skies, a 'KAT must fly... ...we wanna be the good guys..." (Thanks Lance. Some of us got the reference - eventually!)